The Four Wards Podcast - Episode 474: Gimme a Break

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Welcome to the Four Wards podcast. Hey, what's up? It's Eric Bra, voice of Draven, Jerks and Velcas. And you're listening to the Four Wards podcast here to help you move forward in league. Hello and welcome to episode 474 of the Four Wards podcast. I'm your host as usual. I'm Jack Soman and I've got with me two other wards to help you move forward in League of Legends. We've got Free Shooter. [00:00:49] Speaker B: Haven't gotten rid of me yet. [00:00:51] Speaker A: Don't plan to either. We've also got Mike of many names. [00:00:56] Speaker C: I'm here forever. [00:01:01] Speaker A: Indeed. Guys, we are the Forwards podcast. We do have a Discord. The link is in the episode description. Come join the Discord. Come hang out. It's a great time. We got all sorts of channels. If you want to vent about something you have happen in one of your games. We got a channel for that. Got a channel for anime, we got a channel for esports. All sorts of stuff. Come join the Discord. We look forward to seeing you there. Link is in the episode description. We also stream on Twitch. I can be found at Twitch TV jacksellman where it's mostly just been twice a week Super Metroid lately. But whenever I get back into league it will be more league streams freeshooter. You've been doing more of these Elden Ring Challenge runs at Twitch TV free eShooter. Yeah, and I'm also three Es in free. [00:01:46] Speaker B: Yes, and I'm also a PNG tuber now I commissioned some artwork of my cats and set them up with the fugitech thing so they like react to my voice and stuff. It's fun. [00:01:55] Speaker A: Yeah. PNG Tuber. [00:01:59] Speaker B: Woo. [00:02:01] Speaker A: And we've also got Mike of many names streams at Twitch TV mikeofmanynames. Have you been streaming lately? I haven't seen it. [00:02:07] Speaker C: I mean I've been out of town at a convention, so. [00:02:10] Speaker A: No, I mean that's in the past week. What have you known the last couple weeks? What can the viewers expect to find if they go to Twitch tv? Mike of many names. [00:02:19] Speaker C: If I were to stream, it'll probably be either league or whatever the game of fancy is. I play a lot of wow. But that's just like Friday Saturday for rating Monster Hunters. Monster Hunter's on the thing. I'll be playing more Monster Hunter. I'm probably going to get into either Seiro soon to try and figure out how to parry or Liza O. [00:02:42] Speaker B: Both excellent games. [00:02:45] Speaker C: Second row you completely redo because I. I Don't remember anything there and lies of P. I'm on like the first section. I'm not very far in. [00:02:55] Speaker B: Sekiro is one of those games that like every year I'll just go back and replay. It's such a good game. It's probably the like most tightly polished of any of Realm's games. [00:03:08] Speaker C: If they had Bloodborne on PC I would be playing it. But sadly they don't. [00:03:13] Speaker A: If only. Alright, we gotta give a shout out to Codex, Ninja, Pillow Pet and Robegon for supporting us at the shoutout tier. We appreciate you guys so much. We literally could not do the show without you. Now if you want to support the podcast, head over to patreon.com theforwards podcast $1 a month just tells us that you love us. $5 a month gets you an exclusive feed of some behind the scenes audio of our prep work before each show and sometimes stories that we don't feel comfortable telling on the main pod. And $10 a month will get you that exclusive feed and you'll get a shout out at the top of every episode for as long as you maintain that subscription tier. Last but not least, listeners, the only new question that we got this week was from the Discord and it was from Codex Ninja, who obviously supports the show. I appreciate you Codex, but the rest of you listeners, I expect to see more questions in the inbox next week either through the Discord in our question submission channel or at the fourwards podcast gmail.com I want to see those questions guys. If we run out of questions, we have a short episode because we just don't have anything else to talk about. Yeah, right in y'all. [00:04:29] Speaker B: The lifeblood of the show. Like we can on the patch weeks. We can ramble about patch notes like for a while, but I mean patches are only every other week. [00:04:39] Speaker C: So I think, I mean if we got enough, I'm sure we would be happy to do a Questions episode. But you supply that many questions. [00:04:48] Speaker B: We've done it in the past. Yeah, absolutely. And hey, like we've also taken like listener questions and made them like an entire show topic. [00:04:57] Speaker C: Sometimes that question is so thorough we can make a full topic out of one question. [00:05:01] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:05:03] Speaker A: Yep. And we appreciate those. So please write them in the four words. PodcastMail.com we can turn your question into a topic for an episode instead of having to come up with our own. [00:05:13] Speaker B: Yeah, if you have something you've wanted us to talk about, write it in as a question. We will talk about it. [00:05:19] Speaker C: Yeah, seriously, Ad Nauseam. [00:05:22] Speaker A: So speaking of coming up with topics on our own, we. We came up with a couple of them because we don't think either of these is going to be a super meaty fill a whole episode topic. And the first one, we want to talk about something that I think a lot of new players struggle with. We want to talk about Jungle Clearing 101. Obviously every jungle champion has a few nuances specific to them for their clear. We're not going to be talking about those. If you want to learn a specific champion how to clear, the best way to do that is to go to the champion. Mains subreddit for whatever champion it is, look up a optimized jungle clear that some good player has figured out and learn how to do that. Yeah, YouTube videos, it's. It's a way better resource than any podcast could ever be. Instead, what we're going to talk about are some of the nearly universal elements of jungling that almost every champion should be applying in every clear. And if you don't, your clears are going to suck. [00:06:28] Speaker C: We want to do a preface here. This applies when there are not invades. When an invade happens, you need to change your plan. You can't just keep going standard. Either being invaded as a jungler 1v1 or when the entire team is coming after you, you need to change your plans. These are standard clears for standard drones. [00:06:51] Speaker A: So for example, if I see that the enemy is coming, I'm gonna smite that first camp at 600 to make sure I kill it. If I know I have vision protecting, I know the enemy is nowhere in my vicinity. I'm either not gonna smite it if I'm getting a leash or I'm gonna be smiting it immediately because my champion may have like an execute mechanic on their ability or stuff like that. Like it. It depends. But if they're coming, it does not depend anymore. If they're coming, I'm killing it at 600 instantly so that they don't have a chance to steal. [00:07:29] Speaker B: Yeah. And whether or not to smite that. [00:07:31] Speaker A: First example of what Mike means. [00:07:33] Speaker B: Yep. And I guess we could start there of like whether or not to smite that first camp that is gonna be a little bit more champion dependent in like in all things being equal situation. Like some champions you just really want to get level two. Your clear gets so much better once you have level two. So you just want to kill that first camp as fast as possible to have your second ability. Some champions you don't need to, especially if you're getting A leash. So that one is a little bit more champ dependent. I would say. I typically don't smite my first camp. [00:08:07] Speaker C: But I mean I think this drastically depends on where you're starting as a champion. If you're starting on like you're a red side champion, you're starting your blue buff. Going into gromp either or is a good smite target. You're getting the. The you're not wasting the charge of smite because either of them will be there by the time it's there. If you're a person who starts with a multi camp. If you're either starting on wolves, which is less likely to be done most of the time you see people, they start on Raptors because you want to kill as many things as possible immediately. A Raptors you almost never smite immediately. You can clear Raptors so quickly on Raptors. [00:08:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:08:56] Speaker C: And almost every champion who is starting on Raptors is someone who can clear Raptors almost instantly. [00:09:03] Speaker B: Yeah. Or like has good aoe. Like Kane's a good example. You just start like Q and just two cues probably wipes them all. [00:09:11] Speaker C: So that that's really like the first thing is where are you starting your clear. [00:09:16] Speaker B: Yeah. And probably 80% of the time it's going to be on the buff and it's champion dependent. It's not really like game like there's not much in the game that's gonna affect that. It's basically champion dependent if you're starting your Raptors or your buff. Also you saying that made earlier about like the starting on blue. I didn't realize this about myself, but I think you're right of if I'm starting blue, I'm almost never smiting the blue because I want it for gromp. I'm way more likely to smite my first buff if I'm starting a red buff. [00:09:52] Speaker C: Yeah. It's usually because the red side clears are so much easier to do without smite. You can. [00:10:00] Speaker B: Yeah. Because of the multi cam Raptors very. [00:10:02] Speaker C: Quickly you can clear Krugs very quickly. [00:10:05] Speaker A: Cromp is a big someone like Warwick. [00:10:08] Speaker C: Yeah. Grump is a big one behind. [00:10:12] Speaker B: Yeah. And I do tend to like I skew towards more like AOE champions with clear. Like my most single target champion clear is Jarvan. [00:10:24] Speaker A: Fair enough. So what I was imagining more when I proposed this topic is explaining concepts like how to pull camps to the next camp. So I'll touch on that because I assume new players have no idea what I'm talking about. So if you look up an optimized clear for your champion. One thing you will almost immediately see is that they are going to in between auto attacks or spells, they're going to take steps towards the next camp and kind of walk the camp. They're fighting towards the next one to the edge of the leash radius. And then the other thing you'll see is when they get the camp low enough that the next two attacks of your jungle pet will finish the camp, they just stop hitting it and start walking to the next one. [00:11:14] Speaker C: This is a practice. [00:11:16] Speaker A: That one takes practice. It takes experience. Knowing how much damage does your jungle pet do? How much damage do you do? Getting a feel for all of that. But when you get a feel for it, you get that camp down to 20 health or whatever the threshold happens to be at that point and you just walk away and it just dies behind you. Feels great. And that's how you get your clears to be fast. If you've seen players go in and come out at 3:30 when the scuttle crab spawns and they're level four and you're level three, it's because they're doing this. [00:11:51] Speaker C: Yeah. This does a drastic increase to your clear speed. You're not every auto attack early on is like a second plus for most champions. So you're taking a long amount of time to do auto attacks because everybody needs to auto attack and then the extra 23 seconds per camp of travel time. So these are, these are like the core mechanic in speeding up your jungle. This is something you practice in practice tool not in ranked. Because if you miss time that that jungle camp is now back and it's at full health and you've wasted your entire 20, 30 seconds. [00:12:35] Speaker A: Yep. [00:12:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:37] Speaker A: And speaking from experience because I've definitely done that in ranked games. [00:12:41] Speaker B: Oh yeah. [00:12:42] Speaker A: It's tragic. [00:12:44] Speaker B: And I think basically all of what we're talking about here should be things you can practice and practice tool. Like this is all gonna be like first clear before you interact with champions type stuff. [00:12:56] Speaker A: That's. That's the nice thing about jungle specifically is jungle is the easiest part to practice your early game in Practice tool you can literally just go into practice tool and practice your clear until you can six camp without a leash before 330. [00:13:10] Speaker B: Yeah. And also. [00:13:12] Speaker A: And most jungle champions can do that by the way. There are very few that are viable junglers that cannot six camp by 330. [00:13:20] Speaker B: Yep. And most champions should be clearing without a leash at this point. Like I think yeah, a lot of lanes will still just by habit leash, but you shouldn't need one Yep. [00:13:36] Speaker A: I usually will ping my my lane away. I'll be like, no, I don't need a leash. Because by leashing they are sacrificing lane prio and lane tempo and making it much more likely that they need me to come bail them out. So I don't want them to leash because I don't want to have to go to a specific lane. I want to have the freedom to choose. [00:13:57] Speaker C: If you know for a fact you're going to go and do like a level two, level three, gank on that lane, this is a great way to bait that out. This is something you'll be asking these people, hey, I'm gonna be doing this. This is my plan. Can you help me do this plan? But these are. You're now sacrificing that first three. 30 minute clear. [00:14:20] Speaker A: Yeah. So the other thing I wanted to touch on with Jungle Clearing 101 is choosing your route efficiently. No matter how much you kite the camps from one to the next, if your route's stupid, you won't clear it in time. Spend the minimum amount of travel time between camps. So for example, if you're starting on the blue buff, the logical next step is Gromp, Then it's Wolves, then Raptors, then red buff, then Krugs, because that's the least walking time between camps. Now, is that the optimal six camp clear for every single champion? No, there's always going to be a couple exceptions. Is that the optimal six camp clear in every game? No, there's going to be a couple exceptions. Sometimes you want to delay the red buff to the sixth camp just to make sure it lasts longer for the PvP you're going to be doing in the next two minutes. But as a general rule of thumb, you want to plan your route accordingly so that it is a logical route if you're starting on the red side. Unfortunately, that route involves more walking because it's red into Krugs into Raptors, it's still often faster because the champions that are good at those clears suck at killing Gromp. So you want to be level three by the time you get to Gromp. [00:15:44] Speaker C: So let me give you a question for this one, actually. If you are a champion, who does Raptors first? Would you prefer to go to red Buff or Krugs? Because no matter what, you're going to have a long walk at the end of it. [00:16:03] Speaker A: I don't think red buff second is ever the right play. If I'm a champion. Who's doing Raptors first? My second camp is Krugs then I'm doing red buff. The reason being so I have the red buff for longer. And when I hit level three, I am closer to where I want to be. Either the lane I'm going to gank, which could be mid or bot could be mid or top depending on where I'm at or the other half of my jungle. Yeah, that is my answer on that. [00:16:37] Speaker B: I like finishing on the no matter which side I'm on because I feel this when I'm on red side and I start blue buff. I do generally prefer ending in the blue buff quadrant because it's typically quicker to get into the river to start scuttle crab. I feel like if I'm going straight from like if I end on Krugs like I do the blue side, the red side started blue clear up. I'm like, I'm generally second to the scuttle. Like I usually. If I feel like it's going to be contested, I'll oftentimes like skip my Krugs to try and get there sometimes and then like circle back afterwards. But so sometimes it can be corrected instead. Just start on your red side. Do like opposite clears. That way you get the free scuttle in the bottom river. If you don't want to fight your opponent at the scuttle crab after your first clear. [00:17:35] Speaker C: Yeah, that is. That is another one of those things. You are very likely to see people clearing from bot side to top side as opposed to going from top to bottom. So almost all the time the top Krug is the top scuttle is the one that is fought over. If you want to just be non interactive. And as we've already said, you don't really need a leash at this point in time. With a viable jungler you can start top side, move down and about. [00:18:08] Speaker B: And this is one of the advantages of a fast clearing jungler too is like if you get good at this, if you practice like you're kiting your camps effectively, you know you're cutting out those seconds you can be on that top scuttle before your opponent is. Yeah, when I was playing amumu a lot that I was consistently on scuttle before my opponent and that's just like I wasn't even doing this stuff optimally. Amumu is just ridiculous on first clear. Like he clears the red side of the jungle so fast. [00:18:41] Speaker A: He clears the red side of the jungle so fast. He clears the wolves so fast. It's literally only gromp and the two buff camps that he's slow at and. [00:18:50] Speaker C: He clears those remarkably fast for an aoe. Clear. Because he does percent health damage. He's actually good at it. [00:18:57] Speaker A: Like, he's average at those. [00:19:00] Speaker B: Like, honestly, he's one of those that, like, if your bot lane stays and like gives you a leash on that first buff, your clear speed is going to be insane. [00:19:11] Speaker A: Yep. But you still shouldn't let them leash start. Raptors. [00:19:15] Speaker B: Correct. [00:19:18] Speaker A: Okay. Any other thoughts about Jungle Clearing 101? [00:19:24] Speaker C: We did be utilizing your abilities for movement. [00:19:29] Speaker A: Yes. Oh my God. That is a good call. So explain what that means. [00:19:34] Speaker C: So the easiest one to talk about this with is Kane because Kane has two separate ones. We can talk about Kane. Kane has his Q, which allows him to dash a little bit. It goes through a wall and then he does his aoe and then he has his E, I believe is what he does to do the waltz through walls. Just movement. [00:19:54] Speaker B: Yep. Get all the health back. [00:19:57] Speaker C: You should be using these pretty much on cooldown as long as it doesn't interfere with your direct next camp. So. [00:20:06] Speaker A: Yep. [00:20:06] Speaker C: If your Q is like a 10 second cooldown at first level, I don't remember what is off the top of my head. [00:20:11] Speaker A: I think it's like six or eight. [00:20:13] Speaker C: Whatever it is. [00:20:14] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:15] Speaker C: You can use it to waltz through a wall to completely cut out that extra movement and like from. So let's, let's give a good example. If you cleared, you're on red side, you cleared your blue side. You're at level three. You've used your E to waltz through the walls to give yourself a little movement speed. It runs out midway through. And then you get to the point where you'd have to walk around the little wall to go into your Raptor camp. You will just queue over that wall to clear into it, cutting out an extra three seconds. [00:20:51] Speaker A: Yep. The. The loss of the like initial pass through damage on some of the raptors doesn't matter versus the time you save by just not having to walk around. [00:21:07] Speaker B: Yep. Another one for this is Jarvan. Like, yeah, your Q is damage, but eqing over the wall. Like going from red to Krugs, for example, you save more time than you would hitting them with that first Q. [00:21:26] Speaker A: Or we talked about amumu, obviously. You bandage toss from camp to camp. Remember where the big member of each camp is and make sure you aim for them on your bandage toss. [00:21:36] Speaker B: Mm. [00:21:37] Speaker A: Because if you bandage toss the little wolf, for example, you've gotten there and that sped it up. But that wolf is always going to die before the big one. So you're not Speeding up your kill on the camp as a whole. You're just getting there quicker. [00:21:51] Speaker B: Yep. [00:21:52] Speaker A: But if you aim your bandage toss slightly more to the side and hit the big wolf, you've now dealt like a hundred damage to that big wolf to start the camp off. And that's the one that's gonna die last no matter what you do. So you're speeding up the entire camp. Same thing with raptors. You want to make sure you aim for the big raptor with your bandage toss. And other champions have similar effects. Amumu is just like one of the most blatant examples of it. [00:22:17] Speaker B: Yep. [00:22:18] Speaker C: And there are also a good chunk of champions who have some form of increased movement speed within their kit. A passive something else or an ability that has a cooldown that is reduced by things being hit. These are some of the few champions that you're going to be like, all right, I've camped my movement, My movement. I'm using this ability one last time to make sure it's got its reduced cooldown. Or I'm using it one last time to give myself that enhanced movement speed as I move along. [00:22:46] Speaker B: Lily is the classic example. [00:22:48] Speaker C: Lillia is the classic for the movement speed. Skarner and Hecarim are the classic. I don't think Skarner does it anymore. So Hecarim would be the one who does it for the reduced cooldown. [00:22:57] Speaker A: Now, I don't claim to know what Skarner does anymore. I've played him since he got reworked like once. And I was like, yep, still don't like this, champ. What I was gonna say is an example of this is Volibear. Volibear's Q is an auto attack reset. It also gives him run speed. After you've three camped on Volibear, the correct way to play him is to make sure you proc your passive on the last auto to kill the last as you kite it away to reset the timer on it and then queue your ass across the mid lane and then drop a lightning storm down on the next camp as soon as you're in range. And if you do all of that correctly, you don't drop your five stack. And it turns out that's the fastest way to clear the camps. [00:23:39] Speaker C: Yeah, you don't drop five stack. You get a shield and you get your Q proc. [00:23:43] Speaker A: You don't get the shield doing that. It does not matter. You're just maintaining the five stacks because otherwise you have to hit five times to start chaining lightning again. And that's slower than anything else you could do. So maintaining that is faster. And this is why we say that for your individual champion clears, you want to go to your champion main subreddit and find clear videos that show and hopefully also explain how the clear works, because most champions do have these kind of weird nuances. [00:24:14] Speaker C: Jax very briefly touched on it. He doesn't like some champion clear. Jax plays jungle a lot. He doesn't play a lot of every champion. He plays a ton of champions. There will be points when you get to a champion and you go, I don't like it. I'm done. This. This feels wrong. I don't like how this works. Yeah, switch. There are so many different champions that play so many different styles. Start looking for something that feels good, because if you don't like the clear, don't do it. Get a different one. [00:24:45] Speaker B: So it's funny to me. I was just gonna give an example of that. I'm an ADC main. I don't like playing graves in the jungle because of the specific way you have to play around kiting your camps. I am, like, I much prefer playing melee junglers because I'm not amazing at, like, perfect kiting my camps. And that's a lot more important on ranged champions. [00:25:06] Speaker A: That's what I was gonna ask is. So do you play kindred? Who's the most traditional marksman? Jungler? [00:25:10] Speaker B: I do play kindred, yes. But I don't like playing graves. [00:25:15] Speaker A: Fair enough. Graves plays, like, his own thing, so I get that. Whereas if you had said also, no, you don't like playing kindred in the jungle, I'd be like, okay, that's a whole. You just don't like how marksmen work in the jungle. [00:25:28] Speaker B: My discord icon's literally kindred. Like, she's one of my favorite. [00:25:31] Speaker A: Okay. But there could be other reasons for that. I'm leaving the benefit of the doubt open for you. [00:25:37] Speaker B: She was like my go to jungler a long time ago. I haven't played her in a while just because most of when I jungle now, it's like I'm filling in for a fives team, and I'm going to be a role player and just play like a tank or an engage person in my life for ire. [00:25:50] Speaker A: Yeah, that makes sense. So this find a champion you like kind of segues nicely into our other topic for tonight, which is I'm swapping to a new role. Who is the first champion? I should learn in that role. And the way we've divided this up, each of us has a role we're gonna pick, and we're gonna name a champion in that role and try to justify why that's the one we think everyone should learn first, while the other ones, we get to make fun of that person for picking that champion. [00:26:22] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. This is. Each of us has not told the others what the we're planning on for this one. [00:26:27] Speaker A: So. So this is the intention here is for this to get a bit contentious. [00:26:32] Speaker B: Yep. [00:26:33] Speaker A: So free shooter, we're going to kick it off with a role none of us main. So maybe this will be a nice way to ease us in top lane. If you're a new player switching to top lane, who should you learn first? [00:26:46] Speaker B: I feel like this is going to be a very contentious pick, but I have my reasons and I can back this up. My pick is Renekton. [00:26:54] Speaker A: And why Renekton? [00:26:55] Speaker B: So I do think Renekton is probably a little on the like, classically complex side of like, he's not like an MBESA or like one of the newer, like new complex champions, but he's like complex for an old champion. And like, you have to pay attention to the rage mechanic and like stacking with your autos essentially and making sure you're using the right abilities with your empower, with your empowerment. But I also think he kind of exemplifies a lot of the Top Lane laning patterns of you are like just going for getting yourself some farm. And then he can take those quick in and out trades of like, dash in, get that empowered, stun the big cue dash back out. I think he's kind of that like archetypical, like never really bad in the right hands. And you learn a lot of matchups. Playing Renekton. [00:27:57] Speaker A: Makes sense to me. I actually think Renekton is the perfect choice. Not because of anything related to balance, but because I think Renekton embodies the mentality and spirit of Top Lane, which is you fight. [00:28:10] Speaker B: Yeah, I. That's kind of what I was thinking. And also probably I'm not good at top lane. I've literally never played him. [00:28:17] Speaker C: I mean, the other person here is he is a resourceless champion that is immensely powerful on top lane. [00:28:24] Speaker B: Yeah. My other pick was also going to be a resourceless champion, but I think they're very much Easter famine. So I went with Renekton instead. [00:28:36] Speaker C: It is not who I would have gone for, but I. I think it's a good one. [00:28:44] Speaker A: All right, so we had a little bit of pre show bickering about this one Mike Jungle. [00:28:52] Speaker C: So I gave a name out earlier because we were talking about a things but this is not who I will recommend. I'm going to say that I think the champion you should learn in the jungle is Lee Sin. [00:29:06] Speaker A: What? [00:29:08] Speaker C: Lee Sin is never bad. He is always maintained as a good champion. He has every mechanic we were talking about to be a good jungler. He has very easy to use early game. He's very powerful very quickly. He's got executes within him so he can move around quickly. He has that increased mobility of getting over camp walls very quickly. He has healing inherent in his kit. He has shielding inherent in his kit. Aoe single target. He has everything you want as a jungler. And he's never allowed to be too bad because Riot really likes Lee Sin. [00:29:57] Speaker B: Because he's very flashy counterpoint. He's hard. [00:30:03] Speaker C: He's a difficult champion, hard to play. [00:30:06] Speaker A: But he is one of the hardest champions to play on a mechanical level. And that's why I think both me and Free Shooter have the same choice. Instead, I think you, both of you. [00:30:18] Speaker C: Have let's pick the easiest thing possible and you're. You're going with. Let's do this as the easiest thing, which I will agree with you on where I'm going next. I think the jungle is something that you get to sit there and you get to play around on your own. You get to figure out how Lee Sin works without having to deal with other people. [00:30:39] Speaker A: And that's fair. But Amumu is also kind of immune to metas and much easier to play and especially in lower Elo, incredibly much more effective most of the time. Having ults win games, having. [00:31:00] Speaker C: Having a hyper tank and in the jungle is always a good thing. Just having a hyper tank on the team and being able to say, I'm taking it in the jungle is always good. [00:31:08] Speaker A: Not even necessarily a hyper tank. If you get ahead, you build liandries and you're a murder bot who's also a tank. I think me and Free Shooter both agree it should be a moomoo is the first one you learn. [00:31:21] Speaker C: They're. [00:31:21] Speaker A: They're humming never bad. [00:31:24] Speaker C: Yeah, I had a different one before and it was Nocturne, because I think Nocturne is possibly the easiest person to gank with in the world. So he has. He has the biggest crutch in the world. But I think if you. If you want to learn a role, Lee Sin will teach you jungle and allow you to do things because it is what he is good at. [00:31:45] Speaker B: I think the problem is you're spending more time learning his kit. I still don't know what the second half of half his abilities do really? [00:31:52] Speaker C: Oh wow. [00:31:53] Speaker B: I don't know what is eat the second half as he does. I legitimately don't. [00:31:57] Speaker C: It's a slow when it gives you the lifesteal. [00:32:02] Speaker B: Energy. Management's also a pain. But yeah, let's go. [00:32:06] Speaker A: I. I hate energy champions. They all have a weird gimmick to refill their energy and it frustrates the out. [00:32:13] Speaker C: Outside of I think Ambesa his is the easiest because Ambesa's is just hit once for every time you cast and. [00:32:19] Speaker A: Besses is just his but easier. [00:32:22] Speaker C: Exactly. [00:32:23] Speaker B: Shenz is pretty easy to Shenz is press Q and then auto attack. [00:32:27] Speaker A: Sure. [00:32:28] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:32:29] Speaker A: Okay. So I got mid lane because I'm the one of us who plays mid lane the most. And I think mid lane is the hardest one to answer this question before in years past the generally agreed upon answer was Annie. But I don't think it's Annie nowadays. She's outranged by too many mid laners. And when you are not having a good game on Annie, you feel helpless. My answer for mid lane is who should you learn first? If you're picking up mid lane is Ahri. Here's why. Ahri has good wave clear. Her Q annihilates waves at like one item. Her kit is really straightforward. All of her abilities do what they say on the tin. You can use them like twice and you fully understand what her abilities do and how to use them. Ahri when behind can fall back to being a pickbot. You just look for charms and play safe when ahead. She can be a bully and an assassin. She has good roams so she teaches all of the skills that are important to mid lane. I think she's a great all rounder champion that teaches you what mid lane is about because mid lane is about either dominating your opponent or pushing and roaming. And she's good at both of those things. Yeah, I had while being easy to play. [00:34:04] Speaker B: I'd like three champs in my head but no, I think ours a good pick. I think that makes sense. [00:34:08] Speaker A: I'm curious who you who else you were thinking of? [00:34:11] Speaker B: My gut was Lux but like Lux is just kind of an easy champion and you're it's again like you're effective from behind. You like outrange most threats. But yeah the only weird part to me to Ari is like the damage on your alt sometimes feels a little unintuitive to me of like but that's it. The rest of her kit is like yeah, you're right. You use Each ability once you know what it does. [00:34:40] Speaker C: She's very simple to learn. I think she's another one of those champions where if you're in a similar manner to Annie, if you're behind, you feel worthless. Annie is just a better pickbot. [00:34:55] Speaker B: I don't agree. Because Ahri's longer range like you can at least farm safer from her longer. [00:35:01] Speaker A: Range and less committal. [00:35:03] Speaker B: Yes. [00:35:04] Speaker A: For you to be in range for Annie to pick you. Annie is putting herself in the fray whereas Ahri can shoot the charm and run the fuck away. And if the charm hits, she can choose to ult back in. Or if it looks dangerous, she has her ult to also get further away. [00:35:20] Speaker C: I think the reason I still would take Annie as a general thing over Ahri is because it's the reason why Annie became a support as opposed to a mid laner. She can run on much less economy than other mid laners can and still be useful. [00:35:39] Speaker A: While true, I don't think that necessarily teaches you how to. [00:35:43] Speaker C: It's not who my pick mid lane. [00:35:45] Speaker A: Is a high economy role. [00:35:47] Speaker C: It's not who my pick would be. [00:35:48] Speaker A: You have to be able to farm and get gold to be a useful mid laner no matter who you're playing as. [00:35:55] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. My pick would be Xerath. [00:36:00] Speaker A: Fair enough. [00:36:01] Speaker B: Yeah, that's fair. [00:36:03] Speaker A: All right. Well, maybe you'll get a chance to redeem yourself on your picks when we get back to your other one. Freeshooter. You're our ad carry resident. Who's the AD carry that is the first champion. Someone should learn when they switch to AD carry. [00:36:16] Speaker B: I'm so torn between two Honestly, the classic answer that I think is always, has been and will always continue to be true, but I think is probably less true now than it has been in the past. Ash is the tutorial champ for a reason. Or was like Ash has long range, has built in CC on every attack in W. Even if you fall behind, you have your ult. Ash Ult is always good. I think it can be argued that she like she can be a bit of a crutch. I know players that like learned how to play ad carry on Ash and then never wanted to play another AD carry because they couldn't. They didn't really learn how to kite properly because they just were slowing everyone. But I think she's one of the easiest to pick up. My other pink would pick would be Jinx because I think Jinx is just the archetypical ad carry. Like your damage comes from your auto attacks. You Know, you have the mini, you have the two forms. One gives attack speed boost, one gives the little like AOE and more range. You have decent CC for an ad carry. You have a nice slow and the traps for area denial and just damage on your ultimate. Like, I think Jinx is probably one of the most like archetypical ad carries and she's another that's like kind of not allowed to be bad because of how popular of a champion she is. Like, Jinx is rarely bad. Even in metas where, like, because she's a hyper carry. Even in matters where hyper carries aren't that good, Jinx is still. I can't remember the last time she had stuffed 50% win rate, honestly. [00:38:10] Speaker A: Yeah, like I was going to say, like, even when she's a quote unquote bad ad carry, a four item Jinx is terrifying. [00:38:16] Speaker B: Yep. [00:38:17] Speaker C: It's mostly because in those metas, ad carries are not either powerful at all like we saw very early on this year, or most games aren't getting to late game. [00:38:31] Speaker B: That's usually the problem. Yeah. When the games are ending, like average game time is like 29 minutes. That's when Jinx is the worst. But even then her win rate's still like 51% at worst. [00:38:45] Speaker A: Fair enough. All right, Mike, take us home. What's the first support champion? Someone should learn. [00:38:52] Speaker C: So this has to be split into two categories because there are. There are more than two support types, but there's two broad types. There are generally speaking the tanks, and there are generally speaking the enchanters. And there's. [00:39:06] Speaker A: I would go so far as to say, like enchanter is a subset of mage. So there's tanks and mages. And the tanks can be like engage tanks or defensive tanks. And the mages are like mages and enchanters. [00:39:18] Speaker C: There's offensive, but most of the time you will see. [00:39:20] Speaker A: And then there's like Senna, who's like a mage, but she's a marksman. It's weird. [00:39:24] Speaker C: Yeah, but. But I call enchanter over mage because mages are very offensive oriented and enchanters are very defensive. Orient. And in general, when we talk about supports, you start. I'm at the defensive first. [00:39:36] Speaker A: All right. I'm gonna point out that Lucianami was known as one of the most aggro offense lanes we've had in the last. [00:39:43] Speaker C: Incredibly aggro offensive lane. And how many people actually played an aggro offense? [00:39:48] Speaker A: I realize. I'm just saying enchanters can be aggro. They're not still aggro as fuck today they can be. [00:39:54] Speaker C: But their their main power is in their defensive utility. How strong they are at keeping you alive. [00:40:01] Speaker A: Okay, so who are your picks? [00:40:05] Speaker C: They rhyme. Sona and Leona. Sona is the easiest enchanter to learn, bar none. Her Q auto targets enemies. Her E auto targets allies. Her W auto targets allies. You have only one skill shot and that's your ult. And it is a huge cc. There are newer versions of Senna like we were talking about with Seraphine, which are a little fancier and have more frills to them. But for ease of learning, it's hard to go wrong with Sona. She has a little offense, she has a little defense. She has a little healing, she gives a little mobility. She's very good at teaching you to be an enchanter, either offensively or defensively. And Leona is the single most bog standard tank that you can possibly get. She has incredible cc. Her ultimate is a game changing ultimate. She has good tankiness on an ability with low cooldown. She has good CC at low cooldown. She is much easier to get her combos working than someone like Alistair or Rell. She is the best archetypical tank because to be tanky you need less. [00:41:40] Speaker B: Her W is so much free stats, it's insane. I take issue with your picks because I hate playing against Sona and Leona. [00:41:53] Speaker A: I was gonna say I take issue with the Sona. I think Leona is correct. I think Leona is the first if you're gonna learn a tank support. [00:42:02] Speaker C: So Sona is a crutch. The. The champion that I was initially thinking of was Nami. Because in much the same way, Nami is an offensive champion who has good peel, she has good cc and you have very free choice. I'm gonna do damage. I'm also gonna heal. I'm gonna heal. I also get a little free pop things. [00:42:24] Speaker A: See, hear me out. If you wanna learn an enchanter, pick up Lulu. Because Lulu is the universal enchanter. She works with every ad carry. She works with every team combination. It does not matter if your marksman sucks. Lulu is just as good at empowering a mage or a bruiser or a light fighter does not matter. She is great at everything, whereas Nami is much more. [00:42:49] Speaker C: That is why I feel. [00:42:51] Speaker A: And she's good at enabling certain champions. [00:42:54] Speaker C: That is why I chose good appeal. [00:42:56] Speaker A: And she kind of sucks otherwise. She. [00:42:58] Speaker C: She doesn't. What. What Sona does is she keeps people alive and she does some damage. What she doesn't do is she doesn't empower your team in much the same way that Lulu or Nami do. Sona is the most bog standard. I wanna be a support in the same way like Kat. People talk about Yuumi being the selfish bridge. It's this is the graduation from Yuumi. You want to be able to be a support but actually play the game. [00:43:29] Speaker B: You wanna know a fun fact right now? [00:43:31] Speaker A: What's that? [00:43:32] Speaker B: Lulu currently has the fourth highest ban rate. She has a 30 ban rate. [00:43:37] Speaker C: Lulu has one of the most disgusting ccs in the game and I hate her. [00:43:41] Speaker B: Whizzy is so good against assassins. I dive in general. [00:43:46] Speaker A: Yep. And Lulu's ban rate is the biggest argument that I would accept against why Lulu should be the pick because you just won't get to play her a lot of the time. [00:43:54] Speaker C: Jesus. [00:43:54] Speaker B: Nafiri has a 60 ban rate. [00:43:57] Speaker C: NaaFiri is very strong with her new rework, by the way. We were talking about that before. It's much better than we thought than we were talking about. That nun Naafiri is real strong. [00:44:08] Speaker A: Yeah. She's constantly banned in jungle specifically. [00:44:16] Speaker B: I'll be honest. [00:44:17] Speaker A: She's also the winningest mid laner, but she's apparently just op as fuck in. [00:44:21] Speaker C: The jungle right now. That slight tweak to her dogs made her jungle clear. So good. [00:44:27] Speaker B: I feel like as a podcast we have like a 50% accuracy rate on judging the power of reworks. [00:44:35] Speaker C: Yeah, like we undertuned. [00:44:38] Speaker A: That's pretty good. [00:44:39] Speaker B: Yeah, true. [00:44:41] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:44:42] Speaker A: And especially when it's something that isn't directly in our wheelhouses, it's a lot harder for us to nail it. So, yeah, no, we missed the mark on Naafiri a bit. She's way stronger than we thought. [00:44:52] Speaker C: Well, none of us had gotten to play her much and haven't gotten to play much since. [00:44:57] Speaker A: I was gonna say the problem is most of us have been involved in other games lately and haven't been spending as much time on League of Legends as normal. [00:45:07] Speaker C: It'll come back soon. Actually, no, it won't. [00:45:10] Speaker A: I was a. Don't worry, listeners. I'm sure I'll be back on the ranked grind in the next couple weeks. [00:45:14] Speaker B: Zed's out of the top five. [00:45:16] Speaker C: I'll be playing Poe 2 and Last Epoch for the next month and a half. I forgot those were coming out with new patches. [00:45:23] Speaker A: QE2 comes out on Friday. I am skipping the fuck out of it, but it's fine. This isn't a Path of Exile podcast. Let's move on to some listener questions. Ye so Our first pair of questions comes from Codex Ninja, and they're kind of tied together, so we've clumped them together, even though chronologically the second one should be at the end. So Codex's first question is, how do you all stay good at league while taking extensive breaks? Cough, cough. Our current situations. [00:45:53] Speaker B: My last game was two months ago. [00:45:56] Speaker A: It's how do you stay good at league? [00:46:00] Speaker B: I've put in like 5,000 hours. So it's muscle memory. And also typically the first couple games back, I don't do well because I think I am still at where I was when I left. But to give a real answer, actually, I'll hold off because this more answers the second question. So. [00:46:26] Speaker C: There'S no need to worry about taste being good while taking breaks. You have the muscle memory. Generally speaking, if you play a lot of league, you can leave league and come back. But the answer is the same as what's about to be for the next one. It's. My answer is straight up, play a couple of games for fun. Play Arabs, play normals. Play something else to get yourself back directly in the groove. [00:46:53] Speaker B: Get the fingers back. We've. [00:46:55] Speaker C: We've played thousands of hours. Like, I have a year or more in just game time on league. [00:47:03] Speaker A: Yep, same. [00:47:04] Speaker C: So I have put one year of my life directly into playing this game. [00:47:09] Speaker A: I. I don't know the mechanics are past my wow game time yet in league or not. But the fact that I don't know means it's pretty goddamn close. And I put a year and a half of my life into wow. Like actual logged in time. [00:47:23] Speaker C: Much of the same. This is a game that I can walk away from for months at a time and come back and go, what's changed? The mechanics are pretty much the same. Okay, okay, we're done. We're good. I get a little bit of a light refresher. Try and get a feel for. All right. Movement. Yep. Click, click, click, click, click. Okay. Okay. How quick are we moving here? Where's my latency at? Boom. And it's like. It's like riding a bike. [00:47:51] Speaker A: So Codex's other question. We're just going to tie it in, since we're kind of answering both anyway, is, hey, Wards, I've been on vacation for a week and it always feels a little like shaking off the rust when I get back on the Rift. What do you all do when you've had a break and are trying to get back in the saddle? So this one's not about staying good, but like how to de rust. [00:48:07] Speaker C: Exactly. The same thing. [00:48:10] Speaker B: Yeah. So my answer for this one is. This one is very, I mean, laner specific, I guess of like I focus on farming. Like I don't care if I am like, like getting traded on poorly or like, you know, I might miss a gank because I'm like not looking at the map. I focus. The first thing I try and do that first game is okay. Like by three games back, I should hit 70Cs at 10 minutes. Like that's kind of my barometer of like de rusting. I just try and get that fundamental back and let everything else kind of flow back in as I go. I like pick that one thing that's like. Yeah, yeah, I pick that and just focus on it to let everything else kind of the muscle memory kick back in. [00:48:58] Speaker A: Yeah. You pick a familiar champion. Don't cut when you first come back. Is not the time to pick up someone new. [00:49:04] Speaker B: Correct. [00:49:05] Speaker A: You pick a familiar champion. Yeah. You get back into it. Now I mentioned you're gonna hate my answer to this because it's really a cop out. I'm a crazy person. I switch games constantly and pick them up like it's no big deal. I literally can go immediately from high end path of exile play which is a game where you move with left click and it's locked camera always. But it's a top down action RPG and immediately go straight into a ranked League of Legends game and have zero problems. I am crazy. Don't emulate me. I do the same thing with every other video game I play. I will come back after months of playing it and within five minutes be back at where I was before. Yeah. The problem is I'm never that great. Like I'm above average player at best. But games are like riding a bike for me. I never forget. [00:50:06] Speaker C: Yeah. The main thing here is one, don't be like Jax for the first portion of this. Don't start ranked. Your. Your first goal should always just be play one game for fun. Minimum, minimum. [00:50:19] Speaker A: Also, Mike says that because he knows that it's been three weeks since I've played ranked and when I come back to league it will immediately just be jumping. [00:50:27] Speaker C: He will just play right into ranked. Don't. Don't do that. [00:50:31] Speaker A: Yeah, don't do that. Like I am not the example you should be following here. I am insane. And I don't mean insanely good. I just mean insane. [00:50:40] Speaker C: Here's another further. Hey, Jackson, how many games of ranked do you have this season so far? [00:50:45] Speaker A: This season so far? 203. [00:50:50] Speaker B: Ooh, let me get the ratio in. [00:50:53] Speaker A: A year, that's just solo duo and that's just since season started in January. Whenever it was. [00:50:59] Speaker B: You want to guess how many times more games that is than I have? [00:51:03] Speaker C: 10. [00:51:04] Speaker A: I'm guessing 10 times. [00:51:05] Speaker B: 29 because I have seven ranked games. [00:51:08] Speaker A: Oh my God. [00:51:10] Speaker C: I'm in the 10 times because I have about 20. Yeah. Now I'm on the low end. I played less ranked but on average I think people are probably around 50. [00:51:20] Speaker A: 60 if I include flex. I've played 25 of those. [00:51:25] Speaker C: And this is probably one of the. You've been playing a lot more randomizers than you have straight league. [00:51:32] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:51:33] Speaker C: So usually more of my story have. [00:51:35] Speaker A: Been Super Metroid randomizer than they have been anything else. I'd stream the Path of Exile but. [00:51:40] Speaker C: No one watches the the amount of league that Jax plays is enough that a ranked game here or there is not a huge deal to lose. It's still gonna suck to lose but like he can afford one game as a warm up game. He shouldn't. He shouldn't, but he can. [00:52:02] Speaker A: Yeah. Also for context, I looked Steam says I have played 56 hours of Path of Exile 1 in the last two weeks. When I'm playing League, that's 56 hours of League in two weeks instead. [00:52:17] Speaker C: That's a job. That. That's a job's amount of work. [00:52:22] Speaker A: That's my hobby. That's what I do in my free time. That's why I said I'm crazy. Don't be like me. I am not the example you should follow. I will give you advice because I will freely admit I am a freak. [00:52:35] Speaker C: The answer here is play arams or normals to warm yourself up. Usually I would say wait a full day. Don't dive into ranked the first day. [00:52:47] Speaker A: I want to drive this home how crazy I am. That two weeks of 56 hours of path of Exile also includes. I played the entirety of Final Fantasy 4. In the last two weeks, I've played four Super Metroid map randomizers at about two hours a pop. I spent several hours in VR chat. I finished Prince of Persia, the Lost Crown. I don't know how many hours that was. I was most of the way through at that point. I play too many video games, guys. [00:53:18] Speaker B: See, I've. I physically can't. [00:53:22] Speaker A: 40 hours a week. [00:53:23] Speaker B: Like, I physically can't do that. Like I wear like things on my wrists of like I literally cannot do that the last time. [00:53:30] Speaker A: I literally sleep with wrist braces. [00:53:32] Speaker B: Yeah, the last time I did that. I mean, okay, I did that over Christmas break because I got back into Elden Ring randomizers and I played 120 hours of Elden Ring in two weeks. But like, controller games are way easier on my wrist than keyboard games are. [00:53:47] Speaker A: So fair. So yeah, please do not use me as the example to follow. I am a crazy person. But my advice is just play a norm on a champion you're comfortable on to let the rest shake off. If you've been playing for a long time, it'll only take a norm or two and you'll be back at it. And then just, you know, listen to the podcast, read patch notes to see what that changed to figure out. [00:54:13] Speaker B: That's what I was going to say. [00:54:14] Speaker A: If it's. If it's been a long time, look for the like milestone patch notes. So like, if you have not played 2025 league at all, go read the first patch of the season 2025.01 so you can learn what are the big systemic changes. You don't necessarily need all the number tweaks that have happened since, but you want to know the mechanical. What the fuck is an otacon? [00:54:43] Speaker C: For example, maybe just like open champion changes. [00:54:46] Speaker B: I was going to say open the notes and like control left your main and just like see if they got you doing that. [00:54:51] Speaker A: Go to the league wiki for your main and true patch history because true. See all the changes. [00:54:59] Speaker C: Make sure it's the actual league wiki and not the fan wiki because that one stop. [00:55:03] Speaker A: Yes, fandom is bad. Do not go to the fandom wiki. Go to the actual League of legends wiki. Yeah, wiki.league of legends.com. it is literally just the easiest URL in the world. Don't use the fandom one. It's out of date. It lies to you. Okay, now that we've got that PSA out of the way, we have one more set of questions. We're gonna get to this. These come from radio in the discord who writes hello wards newer fan of the pod. I have questions for you for the next episode. What's your opinion on Arena? [00:55:40] Speaker B: I think it's cool. I'm glad it exists. I barely play it, but I love that it exists. I liked what I played with friends with someone. It's a lot of fun. With a random it's not, but I'm glad it's played. [00:55:55] Speaker C: But when I have just one friend to play, sometimes we do arena and nothing but Arena. I haven't done the most recent arena because I haven't played a lot of League recently, but the last time I did 50, 60 games of Arena. It's great, great fun. [00:56:08] Speaker A: It is a really fun casual duo mode. [00:56:12] Speaker B: Yep. [00:56:12] Speaker A: Like, arena is what I would play with friends who are not good enough to play. Ranked with norms. Or I'll play Arena Quick games. [00:56:22] Speaker C: Because arena is very quick. [00:56:24] Speaker A: Yes. [00:56:26] Speaker B: It's very silly. [00:56:28] Speaker A: What are our opinion on any other game modes akin to twisted, treeline, etc. [00:56:32] Speaker C: So the old game modes that. [00:56:34] Speaker B: That ring maps back Dominion. [00:56:38] Speaker A: Yes. [00:56:39] Speaker B: It's fast, it's fun. It's Dominion. It was the best game mode they ever had. [00:56:43] Speaker C: I loved Twisted Tree Line. Twisted Tree Line was my favorite game mode. It was the first game mode I played in League. I enjoyed it. I think Dominion is a good game mode. I think both of them should come back permanently. They already have the assets. Why bother not just having them? [00:57:05] Speaker A: Or at least like, they had a Definitely not Dominion. That was like a Dominion tweaked version that they did once. [00:57:12] Speaker C: Like Ascension. [00:57:13] Speaker A: They should do that again. [00:57:15] Speaker B: Well, Ascension was when Dominion still existed. [00:57:18] Speaker C: Ascension was Dominion's last hurrah. [00:57:21] Speaker A: Yeah, it was its own thing. Using the Dominion map. [00:57:26] Speaker B: I miss old Nexus Blitz. I don't like the current one with, like, the Walking Nest. I mean, like, the original version when it was, like, played on half of Summoner's Rift, where they were, like, testing new items, like, that's what Dead Man's Plate originated. [00:57:41] Speaker A: That was Black Market Brawlers. [00:57:43] Speaker B: You're right. That's what I'm thinking of. I'm thinking of Black Market Brawlers. [00:57:46] Speaker A: Nexus Blitz sucks. I do not like it. [00:57:50] Speaker B: It's fun for a game. [00:57:52] Speaker A: Hot take, maybe, but Nexus Blitz to me is like, what if we made a. Not Summoner's Rift, Summoner's Rift game mode, but also made it so there's no actual gameplay. It's the fucking, like, phone game version of Summoner's Rift. That's like, to me, it's like trying to play Wild Rift on your computer. [00:58:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I fell off of Nexus Blitz quick. I was thinking Black Market Brawlers. You're right. [00:58:16] Speaker C: So we should probably categorize these into two sections. We have the, like, actual game modes and the rotating fun modes. Because rotating fun modes are just there to have random gimmicks and do rotation fun things. Twisted. [00:58:31] Speaker B: I mean, Arenas. Dominion arena is technically rotating. [00:58:34] Speaker A: I was gonna say arena and URF are rotating game modes. They're just rotating game modes that come back regularly. [00:58:40] Speaker B: But the only remaining they have, like, the only. [00:58:43] Speaker C: With other things. [00:58:44] Speaker B: The only, like, permanent modes we've ever had were Dominion, Twisted Tree line and Aram. [00:58:50] Speaker C: Mm. [00:58:50] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:58:52] Speaker C: And on that note, that's the point. Yeah. [00:58:55] Speaker A: Aram is the. The other one we haven't talked about at all. What do you guys feel about Aram? [00:59:00] Speaker B: I play more Aram than I do ranked same like when I'm actively playing league. That's my Like I don't like playing normal games honestly unless I'm playing with friends. Like if I'm playing alone, I'm either playing ranked or I'm playing Aram. And it's like if I'm not tilted or like just don't feel like playing rank but feel like playing league, I'm playing Arams. [00:59:25] Speaker C: Arams is my. I play Aram for fun. [00:59:29] Speaker A: Yeah. Aram is also my for fun mode. However, I have a frustration with Aram. I hate the way they've chosen to balance a few specific champions minus ability haste should never be the way a champion is balanced. [00:59:45] Speaker B: Yeah, that's annoying. [00:59:45] Speaker A: There's a few like digs for example. [00:59:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:59:50] Speaker A: Reduces damage more. I would rather do 70 damage and be able to actually live my champion fantasy of throwing bombs constantly than the minus ability haste that you actually get to experience. Like some champions just feel miserable in a ram because of the a ram balancing. [01:00:07] Speaker B: See I have the opposite. [01:00:08] Speaker A: One of the worst offenders. [01:00:10] Speaker B: I have the opposite problem of I hate the buffs they give to champions that allow them to build full tank while still deleting you Akali. [01:00:18] Speaker C: Yeah, that's just a collie. [01:00:20] Speaker A: That is just a Kali. She does that on Summoner's Rift too. And I hate it. [01:00:23] Speaker B: But assassins are pretty guilty of it in Aram because people are bad at assassins so their win rates are low so they buff their damage and it just makes. When you get a good player gets them. It's unbearable. [01:00:36] Speaker A: So let's. Let's continue on then. Are these modes beneficial for player development in the standard modes? So I'm interpreting that to mean can you use any of the alternate game modes to get better at Summoner's Rift. [01:00:49] Speaker C: 100 play 100 the main reason I say is because you will learn the champions mechanic. If nothing else, you'll be able to play a champion and you learn how to play the champion. Even if what the game around them is different is you now know. I now know how to play Lee Sin. I know how to throw the key. I know how to play my E hits. I know how to bounce back to another player. [01:01:14] Speaker B: Yep. I'd say it's good. The other modes are good and bad at that because even Swift play now, because the balance is different, it could be learning bad habits. Like there's champions. I. I literally have more Aang games than Summoner's Rift games on. And when I take them into Summoner's Rift, I'm not killing people, like at race, at thresholds. I think I should. I'm not killing minions at thresholds. I think I should because of balance changes, item changes, whatever. Like, so. [01:01:44] Speaker A: Yep. [01:01:44] Speaker B: For learning what the kit does. Yes. But for anything more than that, not really. [01:01:50] Speaker A: I. I agree with Free Shooter on this. I think it's really only useful for learning, like, how do your abilities work together, how to do your combos, that kind of stuff. Perfectly valid for that. For everything else, you need to be actually playing actually real game to have it be useful. Practice. [01:02:07] Speaker B: You know what game. You know what a RAM is an amazing hyperbolic time chamber for, though? Learning how to dodge skill shots. [01:02:15] Speaker A: Yes, it is. If you want to learn your fancy fee, a ram's great for that. [01:02:19] Speaker B: Yes. [01:02:20] Speaker A: But I've got what I think is the biggest problem with Aram and other game modes and player development, which is there's no top lane for you to play Lucian in. How are you supposed to just steamroll down their Nexus if you can't even go top with Lucian? [01:02:37] Speaker B: True. [01:02:40] Speaker A: All right. That's how I've chosen to wrap this one up, guys. This has been episode 474 of the Four Words podcast. I've been Jack Sohlman for free, shooter for Mike of many names. Have a great night. [01:02:52] Speaker C: Good night, everybody. [01:02:54] Speaker B: Bye bye. [01:02:56] Speaker A: And send us More questions to the Four Wards PodcastMail.com. [01:03:02] Speaker B: Thanks for listening to the Four Wards Podcast. If you want to support the show directly, consider checking out our [email protected] the Four Wards podcast. And of course, send your questions to theforwardspodcastmail.com so we can answer them live on the show. That's the Four Wards podcastmail.com.