[00:00:04] Speaker A: Welcome to the Four Wards Podcast.
Hey, what's up? It's Eric Bra, voice of Draven Jerks and Velkoz.
And you're listening to the Four Wards Podcast here to help you move forward in league.
[00:00:35] Speaker B: Hello and welcome to episode 490 of the Four Wards podcast. I'm your host, as usual. I'm Jack Soman, and I've got with me two other wards to help you move forward in League of Legends. We've got Mike of many names. I'm still trucking along and we've got Codex Ninja.
[00:00:56] Speaker C: And I'm still wagoning along.
[00:01:01] Speaker B: And I'm still training along. I don't know how to continue this. All right.
[00:01:05] Speaker A: Choo choo choo choo.
[00:01:07] Speaker B: Guys, we are the Four Words podcast. We have a Discord. Come join the discord. Come chat, come ask questions, come play games.
Rant about your favorite anime, whatever it is you want to do. We got a channel for it. Come. And if we don't, let me know. I'll add a channel for it.
I have that power. So. Link is in the episode description. We look forward to seeing you there.
[00:01:29] Speaker A: Okay, he man.
[00:01:33] Speaker B: Some of us stream on Twitch. I can be found at Twitch TV Jacksonman, where I promise within the next day or two, I'll actually play Fallout New Vegas on stream like I said I would two weeks ago.
But otherwise it's mostly been League of Legends and Super Metroid.
Mike can be found at Twitch tv. Mike of many names. Are you gonna be doing more?
[00:01:58] Speaker A: Start off doing Ghost of Tsushima. That already has started. I just have gone back to playing a crap on Night Rain. I need to. I need to. I need to open up more time to do some ghosts. It's so fun. I want to play more of it, but so is Night Rain.
[00:02:12] Speaker B: Fair enough.
All right.
And of course we got to give a shout out to Codex, Ninja, Pillow Pet and Robogon for supporting the podcast at the shout out. T. If you want a shout out or just to support the podcast in general, head over to patreon.com theforwardspodcast $1 a month just tells us that you love us. $5 a month gets you an exclusive feed of some behind the scenes audio of our prep work before each show. And $10 a month will get you that exclusive feed and the shout out at the top of each episode.
Last but not least, listeners, y' all are getting carried by Discord Again.
Send your questions to the email atthefourwards podcastmail.com so we can answer Your questions on the show. We look forward to hearing from you.
With all of that out of the way, guys, it's patch week. We got patch 25.14 this week and there's some changes. Some. It's not a huge patch, but there's a couple of big ones that we're gonna cover when we get to them. But I want to kick it off with something contentious, guys. If you watched MSI or if you've just been seeing it creep into your games more, you probably are aware of Unsealed Spellbook actually being a really good keystone.
And part of that is because it lets you switch to Smite.
And Riot is unhappy with how quickly and how powerfully non junglers are able to switch to Smite and out Smite Junglers.
So they are nerfing unsealed spellbook smite.
It was 600, 900 to 1200 damage based on how many times you had swapped your spell.
It is now 600, 600, 900 damage based on how many times you swapped your spell. Meaning it can never reach the same high point that a jungler's smite can.
And it should hit the 900 point after the jungler does.
If your jungler hasn't 900 by the time you swapped enough spells for your spellbook smite to get to 900, your jungler fails so hard anyway, you probably lose in the game.
I'm unhappy with this for one very simple reason. I actually think it's fine from a balance standpoint.
I personally feel like balance changes should never be at the expense of the highlight moments when something crazy happens is the shit that we as players remember in League of Legends. That's what we're here for. That's the core of the experience And a late game spellbook smite swap, stealing Baron or Elder Dragon or something is hype as fuck. That can be turns around an entire game levels of crazy moment.
So I don't like the late yeah.
[00:05:13] Speaker A: There are so many abilities in the game that already do more than smites damage that are hype as crap to watch someone steal Baron or dragon with that it it I don't really see too much of an issue with it. Doing a full 1200 and you're unless you are perfect instant frame coordination. There's almost always a chance for someone to come in and steal it. If you're the slightest bit off mathematically you leave it at one health the enemy can take it.
I I see no problem with smite being 1200, but I understand why because it makes taking Things really quick when you're allowed to do 2400 damage instantly.
[00:06:02] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:04] Speaker C: So this is why I said like you. Your number just becomes 2400. Right. Because you and your jungler just smited at 2400. They only have 1200. Right. Is that. Is that what we are dealing with? Because I don't do this myself. I just fight people.
[00:06:20] Speaker B: Assuming both sides have a spell book smite and a jungler, they're at parody in both cases.
[00:06:25] Speaker C: It doesn't change that case. Yeah.
[00:06:27] Speaker B: And that's why to me, the basis of why I'm upset about this change is more about like the hype moments of saving the game by getting a clutch steal your. Your support, throwing their life away to get the steel on Baron kind of thing.
[00:06:42] Speaker A: There's a. There's a couple of ways to think about this one. And there's one, there's that, there's two, there's. Most fights, someone is outside of that pit trying to interfere. And most of the time that's either the support or like a tanker or someone. Sometimes it can be the jungler. If they're trying to interfere with the enemy jungler and she leaves someone else to try and take it. This allows you to have another person around with smite to have more interference.
But I think the reason they're nerfing it is they don't like the 1200 number being the number for 2400 because that kills things way faster when you can just pop up with. With instant smites. Plus, if you've got a cho', goth, that's another thousand. Or if you've got a nunu, it's another thousand. Et cetera, et cetera.
[00:07:29] Speaker B: Yep. That's like a third of a dragon's health bar when it's not an elder dragon, just a regular.
[00:07:34] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:07:36] Speaker A: So I think that's the actual core reason they're nerfing it is because of the total damage that it's like you've now shifted the damage train way too high. You can take it way too quickly.
[00:07:47] Speaker B: Especially if you have multiple spell books on one team.
I agree with that. But at the same time, I really wish they had just made it so it was delayed more and then you eventually got the full 1200. I want those crazy long games to have those crazy steel moments be possible. I would have really preferred they just made it so it takes more swaps to reach 1200.
[00:08:09] Speaker A: I mean, nothing is as hype as watching a Jenna tornado steal a dragon or a Baron shot.
[00:08:15] Speaker B: Exactly.
So that's. That's the change to smite. It's spellbook smite is now capped at 900.
It doesn't change much for solo queue. This is mostly a pro skewed nerf, but I just don't like it. Taking away the coolest moments a little bit.
All right.
Oh, so speaking of taking things away.
[00:08:38] Speaker C: Yeah. Think of taking away the coolest moments.
[00:08:40] Speaker A: You.
[00:08:40] Speaker C: Yumi's getting a nerf, guys.
[00:08:43] Speaker B: Oh, thank God.
[00:08:45] Speaker C: Oh my God. I hate this champion so much. So.
So she's only gonna get a minor nerf on her R each time she does her little like send out wave thing.
It is now instead of. It is 30 scaling to 50. That's unchanged. But the AP ratio is going from 15% AP to 10% AP.
And that's great. Like. Yeah. Because fuck this champion. I'm sorry. I hate this champion so much.
[00:09:12] Speaker A: Is. She's such a stupid champion to try and like. It is the ultimate beginner's champion. She should not be.
[00:09:22] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:09:22] Speaker B: And to be clear, with the way she builds the amount of AP she's likely to have and the healing shield power she'll have, it's a difference like 15 heal per hit. Late game.
[00:09:30] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:09:32] Speaker B: So it's not a massive change, but it's definitely a hit.
[00:09:36] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:09:38] Speaker C: Anything that keeps her out of pro or like whatever. I just don't.
[00:09:42] Speaker A: I never want to see you be Karen again. Oh my God.
[00:09:46] Speaker B: That. But just in general. I just don't want to see Yumi be viable outside of like iron, frankly.
[00:09:53] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah, I would like for that.
[00:09:55] Speaker B: She's fine in iron. Iron is such a clusterfuck. Balance doesn't matter anyway. She is like low skill floor champion for players to learn. And if she means that there are more people willing to play support in iron where they desperately need people willing to play support roles.
Okay, I can. I can accept that. But keep her out of everyone else's games, please. Riot.
[00:10:17] Speaker A: Like, there's. There's huge problems when Yumi gets popular and strong.
When she can put her on a hecarim and suddenly that hecarim can't fucking die. Or she is.
[00:10:29] Speaker B: She is game distorting on certain bruisers. Aatrox is a perfect example of this.
[00:10:34] Speaker A: Aatrox Wukong when he gets really powerful.
[00:10:39] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:10:39] Speaker A: Like these are. These are champions that become unbeatable when you pop a yume on.
Yeah.
So let's keep her away.
[00:10:52] Speaker C: Yeah. But speaking of champions that are not.
[00:10:55] Speaker A: Well, a champion that does become unbeatable with a humie.
I'm gonna talk about some briar Real quick, because they made two adjustments to Briar, both of which are really potent. One is significantly better than the other because the bug fix is a huge, huge benefit to Briar.
And the other, the fundamental change that they added into her R makes playing it and hitting her are significantly better for you. So we'll start with that.
Briar now has a CC cleanse when she hits with that missile.
But now, in addition to that CC cleanse, like if she threw out a missile and then you stunned her, she'd be cleansed of the CC and she'd fly.
Now you just flat out gain a CC immunity during the animation, during the cast time.
So when Lee Mitchell is flying.
[00:11:57] Speaker B: Yeah, she cleansed before if. If she fired the ULT and then was cc'd and then the alt hit it cleansed the CC before.
What changed is the immunity during the cast animation after the missile hits, which is awesome.
[00:12:15] Speaker A: One just raw CC immunity is huge.
[00:12:18] Speaker C: Take me through A and B. All right. Briar Prior. So there's a Lux like that. She's. She's thrown with her old.
She's targeting that. She gets cc'd by Galio saying taunt the second after she throws the. The projectile leaves her towards Lux.
[00:12:36] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:12:37] Speaker C: So what would happen in the previous scenario when she'd be talking to Deferral?
[00:12:43] Speaker B: No, she fires the missile, she gets taunted, then missile hits, taunt is cleansed, she chases the. She flies into the.
[00:12:52] Speaker A: Everything depends on the timing of what's going on. Yes.
[00:12:55] Speaker B: But before, if she fired the missile, hit someone and then was taunted while she was winding up to chase them, she would then be taunted and it would fuck things up horrifically.
[00:13:08] Speaker A: Yeah. It would royally mess up how the alt functioned. So, like, she would both be taunted to go to Galio and be flying off at someone at the same time.
Oh, so it would. It would break her AI towards Gallio. Yeah.
[00:13:22] Speaker C: Even though she. After she lands to go get.
[00:13:25] Speaker A: Or she would, like, you could CC her and then the CC would land while she's there.
So, like, sometimes you have a cc, you're hit and then you land and the CC is still going.
[00:13:37] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:13:38] Speaker A: So, like, you could get Morgana binded and then fly across the way and then you'd be stuck.
[00:13:44] Speaker C: And then you just be stuck.
[00:13:45] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:13:45] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:13:46] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:13:47] Speaker A: That kills all that. She is now full CC immunity and clear. Her alt is going to happen. She's going to fire at you.
[00:13:56] Speaker C: Okay. As long as she hits.
[00:13:58] Speaker B: Way higher reliability. If she hits the projectile.
[00:14:01] Speaker A: Yeah. This is just massive bonus to Briar hitting the projectile. You don't always want to hit the projectile, mind you, but.
[00:14:10] Speaker B: But actually hitting the projectile on who you hit it on.
[00:14:13] Speaker A: Yeah. But hitting the projectile now just makes you not get cc'd, which is massive.
The bug fix. This is really great. The bug fix is every bit as good or better.
So the problem that Briar would have is that when you use your W, you no longer have control over who she attacks or how she does it.
And so this just becomes Briar does something.
I've let go of the keyboard. She's going.
You could sort of aim Briar with her Q, but this would sometimes break. And even if you hit a champion because a minion is closer, she's more prioritizing the minion.
Now. This has just been fixed. And if you hit someone with a Q, they're your target.
[00:15:07] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:15:10] Speaker A: That's huge. Because anything that gives Briar an ounce more control is massive. Massive, yeah. If you can aim Briar at someone, she does damage.
[00:15:25] Speaker B: I have literally lost kills to this bug Specific. So I'm really happy to see it.
[00:15:30] Speaker A: There have been thousands of kills lost because of this.
Thousands easily.
And I have done it. I know Jax has done it. I know a good friend of mine who likes to play Briar a lot rule. He plays it. He loses kills all the time. Because Briar just sometimes doesn't do what she's supposed to do, what you wanted her to do, because you lose control.
[00:15:52] Speaker B: She is supposed to target champions during her W frenzy over everything else. If you are jungling and someone walks in range of you, you disengage from the jungle monster and start fighting them inst automatically. So this bug was extra frustrating because it was breaking the expected behavior.
[00:16:12] Speaker A: Yeah. What her cue does naturally is it changes what the priority target is.
So you could choose which is on what to do.
But because of how it was coded, it was now prioritizing the closest thing to the stun, not whatever was done. So if there was like a minion overlapping, suddenly you're hitting the minion.
[00:16:34] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:16:36] Speaker A: And they're walking away with three health.
This is massive. And Briar will feel much better. And if you like playing Briar, play Briar more.
She's been getting.
She's one of the champions where the more you play her exponentially, the higher her win rate is.
[00:16:54] Speaker B: Yeah. So like I was gonna say, and if you don't like playing Briar, you should be happy because having her behave Consistently means that Riot evaluate whether or not she's op and buffer nerf her numerically accordingly. Now that she's functioning as intended.
[00:17:10] Speaker A: Yes.
But yeah, this. This is a champion who, if you put the time in, you are rewarded. And if you occasionally like to play the champion, you can do okay on if you know how she works.
[00:17:23] Speaker B: Yep. She's a knowledge check more than a mechanics check.
That's why I like her. I have a pen to kill on.
[00:17:29] Speaker A: Briar Bro is an amazing champion. I love her.
[00:17:33] Speaker B: That clip is saved on my stream and I am very happy that it was clipped.
[00:17:39] Speaker A: Also. She's. She is one of the best. She's another one of those great personalities. This is like a champion that. When you saw her, when you. When you played her. I like her. She's.
She's what I want.
She's what I wanted Jinx to be. She's just kooky enough.
[00:17:59] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:00] Speaker A: Without being her.
[00:18:01] Speaker B: Her voice.
[00:18:02] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:02] Speaker B: 10 out of 10.
[00:18:03] Speaker A: Great. Love, Brian.
[00:18:06] Speaker B: All right, so we were talking about minions.
I think this champion is basically a glorified minion at this point.
Twisted Fate got nerfed again.
They nerfed specifically his Q.
And this sounds like a really small nerf. It's just a 10 base damage nerf at all ranks.
Here's the problem and here's why I think this nerfs the champion into the ground. Twisted Fate's damage already sucked. To be clear, like Twisted Fate is a low damage champion because his W is so reliable. It's f cking click stun.
And yes, I realize some people are probably screaming right now. I've been one shot by a Twisted Fate blue card with a Lich Bane and a Q instantly killing me, I realize. But that's more unreliable because there's no stun involved. You can dodge the card.
The reason that this nerf annoys me is that Twisted Fate relies very heavily on breakpoints to be able to clear the casters in a single Q.
Yep. And this puts him below that unless he's very far ahead.
He needs a lot of ap quickly to be able to clear casters at level five now, whereas before it was near automatic.
He's just going to leave them with a little bit of health left and it's going to suck ass.
[00:19:33] Speaker A: And yeah, this is going to really hurt the early roll.
[00:19:37] Speaker B: And. And then again, at levels seven and nine, you're actually going to need to use a red W as well as the Q. You're not going to be able to just cue the backline and Wipe them. And other mages still get to do that.
Other mages just cue the backline in its dead.
Or wherever their bread and butter spell is.
That's why I'm unhappy about this change. I feel like if you were going. If you feel Twisted Fate is too op, you can nerf his passive. Just make it so it generates less gold.
You can nerf other aspects of his damage. His Q damage is kind of what he needs for AP builds on him to be functional.
Like, I don't see a point in playing AP Twisted Fate anymore with this change.
Just go on hit and just be the. The machine gun of death. Because it's the only way Twisted Fate actually kills people.
[00:20:30] Speaker A: And even still, I think you're better supplying any carry.
[00:20:33] Speaker B: Yes.
And that's the problem is just Twisted Fate kind of sucks.
And I don't know why they're nerfing. Well, I know why they're nerfing him. They're nerfing him because pros are still dominating with him.
[00:20:46] Speaker A: Yeah. The big problem is that pro distorts champions, and he's a distorting champion.
[00:20:52] Speaker B: And also, please do not build the way the pros build in solo queue. Stop building fucking rapid fire cannon. Your games aren't organized enough for that. And you do no goddamn damage when you build rapid fire cannon on tf.
[00:21:05] Speaker A: If. If you're going, and if you are, it better be your last goddamn item.
[00:21:09] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:21:10] Speaker B: Not second or third like they do.
[00:21:13] Speaker C: Jesus.
[00:21:14] Speaker B: It's. It's. It's. It's very good in pro where they are very organized and that extra range lets them do things.
We are disorganized in solo queue. Please stop doing it. I'm so fucking sick of seeing Twisted Fates. Build rapid fire cannon and do no goddamn damage.
[00:21:29] Speaker A: If you want rapid fire on tf, play Arabs longer range stun on Arams is better there than anywhere else in. In regular games, you care power about damage, do more damage.
[00:21:48] Speaker B: Yeah.
All right, Codex, your turn.
[00:21:54] Speaker C: Speaking of doing more damage.
All right.
[00:21:59] Speaker A: I was gonna say, speaking of 80 carries.
[00:22:01] Speaker C: Oh, well, I mean, you know, I don't know if I would talk.
I don't know. It was very weird when I first played tf.
He did seem like a mage who was pretending to be an adc. I was like, this is really, really interesting. It's like a mage, but he's pretending to be an adc.
He does, however, not build ADC items.
So we have three new changes to the ADC items. First off, we have a change to Bork Blade of the Ring King.
It is going from current on health like current health on hit from 8% and 5% ranged or 8% melee, 5% range to 9% melee, 6% range.
I don't think that this is a material difference. I don't. I think pros will care. I don't think us will care.
Yeah, sorry.
[00:22:55] Speaker A: This is a small numbers tweak to the champions that are pretty much bound to bork to be able to kill tanks better. And it's a, it's a damage buff to the. The whole.
The, the whole on hit champion range. It's not a lot, but it's a little.
[00:23:12] Speaker C: And for, for the purposes of ADC, it does not like 1% that lower just isn't going to materially probably matter for us. It will matter for like Aurelia. It will matter for. For Viego, the people.
Yeah. So in yone, which, you know, one of them got a nerf recently which I will discuss soon.
So then we talk about Kraken Slayer. So Kraken Slayer got, I think a decent buff.
Its price is going from 3100 to 3000 and then damage amp based on missing health is going from 0 to 50 to 0 to 75%.
So I don't know, this one might be good.
It's going to depend on the damage amp.
I do think that, that, that the, the price, the price going down is something that is desperately needed for it.
But yeah, I don't, I don't see this as like a game breaking like all, all ADCs are going to be bound to Kraken now. Like, I think that it, it's a, it's a small numbers burp to make it a little bit more on parity with the others.
[00:24:26] Speaker B: So this is a significant buff to AD Carries who were already relatively Kraken bound, such as Kaisa.
And it is a nudge towards Kraken Slayer for AD Carries who were like, I could go bork for more tank busting, but there's no tanks and I don't really care that much about the lifesteal.
Go Kraken instead.
[00:24:46] Speaker A: Yeah, the price difference makes it a huge benefit for early building.
[00:24:51] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:24:53] Speaker A: So this, this could be another one of those early like first item builds again.
[00:24:57] Speaker C: Yep. Well, and Kraken should be a first item. It's actually built like a first item. Whereas like the thing that I hate about Yuntal and, and Bloodthirster first item, like dude, like BF Sword is just so expensive, man. When I played Kaisa for the first time, like, like Cycling her in, it was just like, oh my God. Is this what people feel like when they build their first item? They don't just feel like they want to just jam like something into their eye? Like, oh my God. It's just nice.
[00:25:26] Speaker B: And to be fair, like, Yuntal's intended weakness is that its build path sucks. Yeah.
[00:25:33] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:25:33] Speaker B: But I think that because without that so strong. It's so strong without that, it's just the best AD carry item.
[00:25:40] Speaker C: Fair.
[00:25:40] Speaker A: But it is. It is one of the few 80 care items that gives you all three stats.
[00:25:44] Speaker C: It I think though that like, you shouldn't, like, you shouldn't design a bad, like something that feels bad.
[00:25:51] Speaker A: Well, the reason. The reason it is like that is because it is. I'm actually, I'm fairly positive it is the only ad carry item left that gives all three of the core AD carry stats. Damage, attack, speed, crit.
It doesn't auto give you the credit, but since it is the only one left that gives all three, it needs to have a downside.
[00:26:09] Speaker C: Yeah, and. And the idea that it has like the scaling passive where like you don't get your crit instantaneously, I actually thought that was fantastic. Like that was a really great way to. To, to allow it to kind of level in a bit. But I just. I don't know, man. Like, it feels like ass. And it's just nice to have like, items, especially first items that are like, nah, like this is a. A first item leaning kind of kind of thing.
I can take my BF swords once I have like my first item and stuff like that.
[00:26:38] Speaker A: You don't see this on mage items. There are no mage items that. That start with a needlessly large rod.
[00:26:45] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, exactly. There's no. There's no starting mage item.
[00:26:49] Speaker A: The only big difference is, is that mages are so manigated that they need to have mana in their builds. So they need to have something that either gives them mana back or gives them charge large chunks of mana. And raw auto attack damage is just so potent for AD carries. Getting a BF sword is massive, but trying to save for one is a.
Yeah.
[00:27:10] Speaker C: So the final item that we've got on the ADC core here is Phantom Dancer PD.
It is moving from attack speed 60 to 65 and movement speed 8% to 10%. And that movement speed is huge.
That is enormous.
So I. I don't know. I don't actually play any. Any champions that play pd. But like, seriously, when I saw it was like buffed like that, I was seriously reconsidering My unara build because like.
[00:27:43] Speaker A: If I'm not mistaken, it is now the highest attack speed item in the game again.
[00:27:49] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:27:50] Speaker A: It already. It already gives you ghosting. Yeah, it already gives you ghosting and all that.
[00:27:55] Speaker C: No, this is, this is a big deal. This is a big deal.
[00:27:59] Speaker B: So it was already the highest attack speed item in the game. It's now even more the highest attack speed item in the game.
[00:28:07] Speaker A: I think this is the reason to build PD is if you do not need to do AOE damage, PD should be your attack speed item.
[00:28:17] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:28:17] Speaker A: On crit builds.
[00:28:19] Speaker B: Here's my take on it.
I think this item was under built already. And this buff is huge for people who should have been building it already.
The. The build you usually see on, like Tristana, for example, she goes Flicker Blade as her zeal item.
A lot of champions are building Hurricane as a zeal item.
[00:28:38] Speaker C: Yeah. And well, dude, all the zeal items suck. What? Like what? Which one is awesome?
[00:28:44] Speaker B: I think the correct choice in most cases is none of the above or Phantom Dancer. Like on Tristana, I prefer Phantom Dancer over Flicker Blade because I want that immediate to kill that first person. I don't give a shit that I'm not resetting my bomb.
[00:29:01] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:29:02] Speaker B: Because the person I had to kill is dead. Okay. I get to be weaker when my Q falls off. Whereas Flicker Blade, Tristana, the Q is permanently up and the E is permanently.
But I got that first kill and I find more value in that.
Phantom Dancer just offers so much. Just if your attack speed scaling and you need an attack speed item and it needs to be a crit based attack speed item, it kills people.
[00:29:30] Speaker A: I, I, I. Yeah, my, my philosophy on this one's really easy.
My philosophy on this one is if you use crit in your build, your one attack speed item should be based on. Do you use spells? You get Flicker plate. Do you need to deal damage to a large amount of frontline, you get Hurricane. Otherwise you get pd.
That is my philosophy on this one. And then there's a couple of small edge cases who want the long range one. The gun.
Yeah, we just said it.
[00:30:02] Speaker B: Rapid fire fire cannon.
[00:30:04] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:30:04] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:30:04] Speaker B: See, I feel like rapid fire cannon should be the most edge case of the four.
[00:30:09] Speaker A: It should be by far like that and Flicker Blade, I think are the two edge cases. Either you need Flicker Blade because you're a caster attack speed Pearson. Like.
[00:30:21] Speaker B: Siver, Zion.
[00:30:22] Speaker A: Siver and Zion. Those are the two that are like, they're hardbound to quick play.
[00:30:28] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:30:28] Speaker A: And the a couple people who really really need the extra range from Rapid Fire, you have Gin who scales off attack speed anyways, but. So this might actually just be more damage for him. Raw it is, but. Yeah, but like, if you want attack speed, Phantom Dancer is so good. Getting this as a second item massively boosts your damage.
And then getting an IH third or doing that backwards one way or the other, like, depending on how easy it is to get an eye edge.
[00:31:00] Speaker B: Yep.
For context, I went. I went to check.
The next highest attack speed items in the game are Nashor's Tooth and Wit's end, both at 50.
[00:31:10] Speaker A: 50. Okay.
[00:31:11] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:31:11] Speaker B: Or a fully stacked rage Blade. At full stacks, it is 57%, but it's only 25% and still until you stack it. So Phantom Dancer beats all of them in Raw attacks.
[00:31:28] Speaker C: So in all of these 80 attack, you know, quote unquote ADC items, they're all used by the. The windshielders, aka Yasuo and Yone.
So this is the first time that I have ever seen, like, preliminary Nerf. Like. Like, they're. They're. They're nerfing him in anticipation of.
So I have never seen an anticipated. I've seen anticipation buffs.
[00:31:54] Speaker B: They've done anticipation nerfs and buffs for Yasmine when they've changed the Crit system.
[00:32:01] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, that's true. Yeah. Yeah. But like.
[00:32:04] Speaker A: And the. And they did it when they've done it. They've done it every time. They've changed the item system in general because when they switched to the Mythics back then, they changed how Yasuo and Yona worked for Crit. Actually, I don't think Yona existed back then.
I think it was just Yasuov.
[00:32:21] Speaker C: Yasuo is getting a. A.
I don't know. This is actually probably a significant nerf. He's going from 80 growth 3 to 80 growth at 2.5. What's interesting is that Yoni is not mentioned. So I guess maybe it's a slight buff to him because, like, I don't know if he's. To be honest, I haven't seen him run Bork before. Does he normally run?
[00:32:41] Speaker B: Yeah, that's his core. First item, Yone.
[00:32:43] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:32:44] Speaker B: That is the core. Always be building.
[00:32:46] Speaker C: I just. I feel like they build shield Bow usually.
[00:32:49] Speaker A: Not anymore.
[00:32:50] Speaker B: She'll both second.
[00:32:51] Speaker C: She put second. Okay.
[00:32:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Shieldbow doesn't have the life steel. Bork offers every stat that the Windshielders want. Except for.
[00:33:00] Speaker A: Correct.
[00:33:01] Speaker C: Except for Crit. Okay, cool.
[00:33:04] Speaker B: But, yeah, I. I just checked all of Yone's top Five builds all start with Bork.
[00:33:10] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:33:10] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:33:11] Speaker C: I'm kind of interested. Like is he gonna go Bork pd?
Like he doesn't need any more crit after that.
[00:33:16] Speaker A: No, no. Because the raw damage on I edge is so powerful and, and both of.
[00:33:21] Speaker B: The wind shitters have a weird attack speed cap with their Q. It does not take a ton of attack speed. Basically Bork plus Zerker Greaves plus a few levels is enough to cap your cues.
[00:33:34] Speaker C: Oh, Cap.
Okay.
[00:33:36] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah.
[00:33:37] Speaker B: So they don't really care about more attack speed past that point nearly as much as other champions do.
[00:33:45] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:33:46] Speaker B: Like it's still good. They still right click you to death and it helps with that. But it doesn't scale their cube beyond that threshold.
[00:33:53] Speaker A: And because they're so hard to almost damage for their cube, you see a lot more damage.
[00:33:57] Speaker B: See them go something like pd. As if like they have to build merc treads this game because there's a lot of tenacity able cc.
[00:34:04] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:34:05] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:34:06] Speaker A: And I think they might be one of the champions who should not build pd.
[00:34:11] Speaker C: Yeah, no, that makes sense to me.
[00:34:13] Speaker B: So you know that exception case, they build PD first with merc treads.
[00:34:18] Speaker A: And just like my, my theory on that is you go shield bow plus I edge. You have your 100 crit there.
[00:34:25] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:34:26] Speaker A: And you get attack speed from Untol or something else in general.
Baby cracking.
[00:34:37] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:34:39] Speaker B: Kraken is good on them, to be clear.
[00:34:41] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:34:42] Speaker A: Because. Because they actually like waste some of that attacks.
[00:34:46] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:34:47] Speaker A: And the only reason that I suggest Jim gets it is because Jim's raw converts attack speed to ad.
So I think, I think with PD he'll have over a thousand AD maxed out.
Jingits, Jinkots and nutty AD Damas.
[00:35:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
I, I, I hate Jyn's front load damage because of his silly AD numbers.
All right, so Yasuo minor nerf. We don't really think it does too much, but it is a love tap in the right direction.
[00:35:23] Speaker A: Any Nerf to Yasuo is a good nerf.
[00:35:26] Speaker B: Yeah. He's definitely the more frustration inducing of the two windshielders. Yone feels more fair when he shits.
[00:35:33] Speaker C: Yeah, no, he only feels like he has a single minded. I am a stat stick. I will whap you if I, if I am.
[00:35:40] Speaker A: He only feels like he has more skill to him.
[00:35:44] Speaker B: Mike just hit the nail on the head. When Yone beats you, it feels like either he was ahead or he had a straight up outplay.
When Yasuo beats you, it feels like his kit is unfair and Deleted your champion by existing.
[00:35:57] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:35:58] Speaker A: His. His move Speed shield. Just walking around making a shield in mid lane. Plus the ability to deny projectiles is so dumb.
[00:36:10] Speaker C: Yep.
It's too long, actually, is what the problem is. It needs to be like Samura. It needs to be and then gone.
[00:36:18] Speaker B: The fantasy was supposed to be a samurai slicing a bullet out of the air. Let him have that fantasy more often, but make it really fucking short duration so he can't do zone denial with it.
[00:36:28] Speaker A: I think that's a brilliant, brilliant way to do it. Just. Just make it.
[00:36:31] Speaker B: Waiting for it for years. Give it half the cooldown, but make it last a cor. Like half a second so he can skillfully block a projectile.
[00:36:39] Speaker A: Even if you want it to be one second. Okay, one full second. In comparison to like five or ten. It is now it's not ten.
[00:36:45] Speaker B: Well, and Samira's I think, is three quarters of a second.
[00:36:48] Speaker C: Three quarters. It's not even a full second, yo.
[00:36:50] Speaker B: Yeah.
So that's why I'm like, just reduce the duration drastically. Let him do it more often. Because now it doesn't deny the zone.
Much more fun to play against and balanceable according.
Anyway, that's enough soapbox. Let me talk about someone who. I don't understand why he's getting buffed, but I'm really happy about it.
Ziggs got some significant buffs.
Both of these should. These should help in both of his mid and bot lane roles. But the intent is for this to be more of a buff for mid lane than it is for bot.
Because mid lane tends to be a higher level faster.
They are adding scaling AP ratios to his E and his Q.
So base damage on his Q went down slightly, but the AP ratio scales up to now 80% at max rank, which means at max rank and one item. This is just straight up, always better. Despite the base damage. Nerf.
[00:37:54] Speaker A: By level four, the ratio is the same because you put two ranks in it.
[00:38:01] Speaker B: And by like level seven, if you have like 50 AP, you're doing more damage than you were before.
It's great.
I don't know why he needed this buff, because that just buffs him in general. It's.
That's really strong.
I'm gonna enjoy it. I was already playing Zig's mid before, but that's not even all of it.
They also changed the ratio on his E. The minefield now goes up to a 45% AP ratio at max rank.
That thing is going to fucking demolish people who walk over it.
Now there is an actual change in here, that is a power neutral change. I think overall, his Mega Inferno Bomb base damage went up.
AP ratio went down.
This is like a buff when you're at low AP amounts and power neutral late game.
[00:39:02] Speaker A: And note, it's only the max center damage. The outside damage is still the same.
[00:39:08] Speaker B: Outside damage is two thirds of max damage. So it's adjusted the same amount. Yeah, but basically, if you have very small amounts of AP, the base damage buff is going to outweigh the AP ratio. Nerf.
If you're like late game, 800 AP, it's a wash.
Is this. So he's buffed in early to mid game?
[00:39:30] Speaker A: I'm sorry, what?
[00:39:31] Speaker C: Is this a support buff?
[00:39:33] Speaker A: No.
[00:39:34] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:39:35] Speaker B: No, because Support shouldn't be getting enough levels to really benefit from any of these things as much because the base damage did not go up at rank one. Like, Zigzag is worse.
[00:39:44] Speaker C: Okay. Yeah.
[00:39:44] Speaker B: Yes. Zigzal is worse from level 6 to 11 period than it was before.
At level 11, it is now better unless you have a lot, a lot of AP11.11.
[00:39:55] Speaker A: The challenge was 50, so you need 500 AP for it to be neutral.
[00:40:01] Speaker C: Yeah. Yep.
[00:40:03] Speaker A: And it's a hundred more at max. And so, like, it's. It's technically just wrongly better.
[00:40:09] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:40:09] Speaker A: Because it never got a thousand.
[00:40:11] Speaker B: AP I've done requires like Elixir and Baron Buff and Full Build.
[00:40:17] Speaker A: It requires you to intentionally do some weird things to get AP that you don't normally get.
Because most of the time when you. When you build normal Zigs builds. Well, actually, no. With the change to Horizon Focus.
[00:40:35] Speaker B: I was gonna say, like, Ludens is 100 AP. Horizon Focus is over 100 AP. Shadow Flames over 180.
[00:40:41] Speaker A: They've added a bunch of ways to get more apart.
[00:40:43] Speaker B: Void staff is like 90 AP, that's like 800. Then you add Baron Buff and Elixir, you're at a thousand.
[00:40:50] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. You're getting pretty close there.
[00:40:52] Speaker B: But that's where the alt does the same amount of damage it did before.
[00:40:57] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:40:57] Speaker B: And it does more damage in all cases before what I just described.
[00:41:02] Speaker A: Pretty much once you're level 11.
[00:41:03] Speaker B: Once you're level 11.
[00:41:04] Speaker A: Yeah. 11 is just a minor buff. 16 is a good chunk. 100 damage is a big pump.
[00:41:12] Speaker B: The key is that it's weaker from below. Before level 11, it's weaker than.
Yes, but this is such a huge buff for Mid Lane Zigs and a meaningful buff for Bot Lane Zigs. Overall, he's stronger at almost all stages.
[00:41:31] Speaker A: Game overall, Bot Lane Zigs, generally speaking, got more gold but had less levels.
[00:41:37] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:41:37] Speaker A: In much the same way that most bot laners have more gold and midlanders have left. So he'd be getting his AP higher versus the level changes. So he's. He's pretty much either neutral or benefiting from the changes once he goes back once.
[00:41:50] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:41:51] Speaker A: To get his first.
[00:41:52] Speaker B: It takes bot Lane Ziggs longer to get to where the ULT is better and his E is weaker for longer.
[00:41:59] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:42:00] Speaker B: But he's still happy with the Q change. So every Ziggs should be happy.
[00:42:05] Speaker A: Which.
[00:42:05] Speaker B: Is please don't play support Zigs.
[00:42:12] Speaker A: Your W is not a good enough cc.
[00:42:17] Speaker B: The one and only lane you should ever play support zigs with is Vegar Ziggs.
[00:42:22] Speaker C: Oh yeah.
[00:42:24] Speaker A: Okay. The shenanigans you can do with that.
[00:42:26] Speaker B: Is hilarious because you want Veigar to be the one far farming so he can get all of the ap and that combo is amazing.
But that's it. That's the only time support Zigs is acceptable. If you're not playing it with a Veigar, you're trolling.
Especially now that they've lowered his ratios or lowered his base damage and increased his ratios.
[00:42:48] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:42:49] Speaker B: Okay, Mike, you've got the big change of the patch. We've saved it for for last.
[00:42:56] Speaker A: Yes. There. There is a.
[00:42:58] Speaker B: Give us the monumental version.
[00:43:01] Speaker A: And there's a monumental change to clad.
[00:43:04] Speaker B: Yeah.
To be clear listeners, if you are a KLED player, please read the entire patch note on kled. This is way too much for us to cover.
[00:43:15] Speaker A: Yes, the. The. The note under KLED is all abilities adjusted.
Every ounce of KLED has been changed passive to his old.
So the base cliff note is they're a little bit tired of having KLED build lethality and they wanted there to be a better reason for KLED to build bruiser.
[00:43:41] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:43:43] Speaker A: And so they've shifted some of his damage a little lower and given him some more health things to deal with so that he is a little bit tankier to build more incentive to be bruisery.
It's a little bit like it. Going through each of the changes is impossible. There's too much to talk about in each. So let's broad strokes talk about the passive change.
The passive with him is his jump on off of Skaarl. That's his passive. If you did not know that they have changed how that functions a little bit.
It still has the same sort of starting health. It still changes what his his damage is based on which form he's on, but they've now made it so that Kled, when he's off, is a little bit stronger and a little bit faster, but it's a little bit harder to get back on unless you are doing consistent damage to Champion, in which case it is easier to get back on.
[00:44:50] Speaker B: Yup.
[00:44:54] Speaker A: The big thing for him is that he's now faster because little Kled was much slower.
Like minus 60. Base move speed slower.
They have upped that to minus 40.
[00:45:08] Speaker B: Still slow, but no longer, like, cannot run at any one levels of slow.
[00:45:13] Speaker A: Exactly. So, like.
And then he. He has a dismounted bonus when you're moving towards enemy champions because he wants to fight you. They nerfed that slightly because he's now just raw faster moving to you.
[00:45:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:45:28] Speaker A: They've made it slightly weaker in how much health you gain when you jump on Skaarl, but that's because you should also be building more health.
So that. That's the sort of Cliff notes of the passive of Skaarl.
[00:45:44] Speaker B: All right. I had two other notes, which is Skaarl health when you remount is instant instead of it being at the end of the animation, which should feel smoother and more intuitive to everyone.
[00:45:56] Speaker A: Yes.
It does also mean that you can take damage a little sooner, but. Yeah.
[00:46:01] Speaker B: Yes. And he now gets bonus armor and magic resist based on his health he's building, which is how they're trying to incentivize Kled to build bruiser now instead of lethality.
[00:46:12] Speaker A: Yes. And. And this scales with how many people you are near.
[00:46:16] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:46:17] Speaker A: So you are just raw, tankier the more people you are around and you want to.
But, like, if Kled's in a. In a fight, that's great. That's what he wants.
The change to his Q. Most of it is that they're doing a couple of little damage taps because they don't like how much lethality damage is doing.
I'm annoyed that they took away this part. They took away grievous wounds on used. When you do the poll, you would take your wounds and. Okay.
[00:46:50] Speaker B: And specifically, it was one of the only sources of a 60% grievous wounds, which I do not think should exist.
So I'm not sad about that, but I'm sad that he lost it entirely.
[00:47:03] Speaker A: Yeah. I think it makes sense to have grievous wounds when you're throwing a bear trap at someone.
The slow is longer, but it's a little bit weaker. And the timer is now consistent. It will always happen the same amount.
Cliff notes on cue.
Half of it. Because the unmounted one is a little bit shorter for initial charge time, a little bit longer for max charge time. Based on ranks, massively reduced base ad, and it now recognizes single target versus AOE for champions. So it's a good ability, but it did too much damage when you built lethal violent tendencies. The. The big note here is it now has a bonus when you have health.
They've touched a little bit of the raw damage in the base ads, but they've given him a scaling bonus health, and they've bumped the cooldown a little bit. Fountain is his attack speed ramp that did damage per, like, hit.
[00:48:12] Speaker B: Yep. It's the. The passive, where he just suddenly gets a ton of attack speed and just beats the out of someone for a couple seconds, and then he's back to normal.
[00:48:22] Speaker A: It now has a better reduced cooldown for champions, but you can't stack it on warts, which is actually significantly stronger because it means you don't lose the stacks on wards.
[00:48:32] Speaker C: But it does mean use the stacks.
[00:48:34] Speaker A: You would use all of those attacks.
[00:48:37] Speaker C: Oh, okay. Okay.
[00:48:38] Speaker A: Well, like, if. If you. If your passive is now off, you just have the attack speed for the next set of stuff. You would eat those attacks before, so now it keeps those attacks.
[00:48:49] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:48:50] Speaker A: If you have the attacks, okay, that's cool.
The E just has a reduced damage ratio because they're tired of lethality.
And his alt. The big change here is he's gaining more health ratios within it, so he has a slightly larger max health damage. Plus he now has a slightly weaker per bonus ad damage, and he's getting some max health stuff. And it's changed from physical to magic, which is huge.
[00:49:25] Speaker C: Does he build magic?
[00:49:27] Speaker A: No, no. The. It's the damage type.
[00:49:30] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:49:30] Speaker A: So his alt, it's just another piece of the kit to give him a little tiny hint of magic damage.
[00:49:38] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:49:38] Speaker A: It's not a huge amount, but it prevents all of his damage from being sucked up for building armor against him.
[00:49:47] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:49:48] Speaker B: And more importantly, it means he can't just build lethality and one shot, a squishy with his old. And then combat that again.
[00:49:55] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:49:56] Speaker B: That's the reason for it. It's the same reason they've done this with Briar before.
[00:50:00] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:50:01] Speaker A: Making. Making things into magic damage has a good purpose here.
There's a long list of bug changes.
We're not going over that.
If you play.
[00:50:13] Speaker B: I do want to show one of the bug fixes because it's hilarious.
Go for not a w. Reviving Kled no longer ruins Kled's health bar. For the rest of the game.
[00:50:22] Speaker A: That's huge.
Yes. Yes. That's massive because it really just kind of wrecked what he looked like. No longer knew what was going on.
[00:50:30] Speaker B: Yep. It was so dumb. I'm glad it's fixed.
[00:50:33] Speaker C: Playing the real way like now going in, bro. I'm not even looking.
[00:50:39] Speaker A: There are. There are too many changes to properly talk about if you want to play Kled. Look at the changes.
[00:50:46] Speaker B: Yes, please.
[00:50:48] Speaker A: We could not cover even half of them because there are that many minute tweaks to him.
He has.
He's. He is a fully redesigned. Like he does the same stuff.
Reimagine retweak.
So if you want to know how to properly deal as cloud, you should check things out.
[00:51:12] Speaker C: Yeah, I will say so. I just went on to a stat site just because I was curious to see how. How the first couple days have gone. He has lost a couple percentage points but he is still sitting at a 48.5. So he's definitely not like sometimes they make like these reworks and they drop like 10% and they're down into like the 40s, the low 40s. And that's just like scary panda. He. He's still viable.
[00:51:36] Speaker A: This means he wasn't propped up by lethality like some other champions were.
[00:51:41] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:51:41] Speaker B: Yep.
And it does look like people are building the correct items on. Thankfully it is.
[00:51:48] Speaker A: He's also just not an easy champion to play.
He's quite. He's surprisingly skillful.
[00:51:56] Speaker B: But yeah, people are building the correct like Titanic, Hydra hullbreaker, Overlord's blood mail type builds.
I'm happy to see that. All right, we're gonna briefly.
Yunara also came out this patch, guys, as we usually do. We are going to give you our full impressions next week once we've had more time with her.
But we have an ad carry main. We have people who think she looks like a lot of fun.
Brief, brief impressions on yunara, the new 80K go.
[00:52:36] Speaker C: All right. I'm the 80K R. I get to start.
All right, so I do feel that y' all are learning how kiting is hard.
So bear that in mind. I think she is balanced.
I do not think she is overpowered. I do not think she is underpowered.
[00:52:56] Speaker A: I disagree heavily. But we'll talk.
[00:52:58] Speaker C: I believe that she is most similar to Zeri. I believe.
I think that there's a lot of reference points from Jinx that are in there as well.
I think that she is actually fun, which, you know, hey, man, like, fun is the important part. She has that, like attack speed. Thing that I crave. I crave on cog point 5.0. I get it on Varus. She has it.
So she ain't easy, though. She's a nuanced champion. She's not misfortune.
So, like, you know, as long as you're. You're understand that it's not misfortune, I think you're going to be fine.
[00:53:45] Speaker B: All right.
So my initial impression of this champion, I agree she's very zeri. Like, she seems numerically undertuned, and I feel like her intended build doesn't have a clear identity.
It feels like the way her kit is designed, she should want to build like, on Hit and maybe some AP in her kit, but she needs crit and those items don't have any crossover, so she has to build crit.
And I.
I think she's cool. I want to play her more, but I hope that we get some tweaks to make her feel more cohesive, because I think that's where she's lacking. She feels like her kid is not cohesive with the item system as it is.
[00:54:45] Speaker C: I do think that Riot is going to create an AP crit item.
I. I honestly believe it.
[00:54:52] Speaker A: There. There are enough ad carry champions who do AP that it's a possibility.
[00:54:57] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:55:00] Speaker A: My thoughts on her are a little bit different than theirs. I think she's fundamentally wrong.
I think she's well one and statistically, she is the weakest ad carry, period.
She has a pretty, like, abysmal win rate for how often she is picked and banned. She has a 45% win rate for 22% pick and 37% ban.
She's dead last out of 80 carries. She has no winning matchups.
[00:55:28] Speaker C: That's totally normal for unreleased. No, if she was rocking a 39, I'd agree with you, but, like, nah. 45.
[00:55:36] Speaker A: No, I.
[00:55:38] Speaker B: Especially as an AD carry whose identity is AOE damage. Again, in the vein of Zeri, I do kind of agree that this is a normal power curve for her early release. That's why we're not talking about builds yet. We're not talking about how to play her yet, just initial impressions, because we don't know that much yet either. Guys, we need more time.
[00:56:01] Speaker A: We'll. We'll see by, like, by next week. If her win rate hasn't changed at all, we will have way better data.
But, like, yeah, she came out. I did some. Some like, raw data running immediately. Just testing her. She has no flexibility in build right now. She's raw, gated to a set of like, Four items. You can change one of them essentially.
Otherwise you are massively nerfing her damage.
You are hardbound to full crit.
She doesn't feel like she has a lot of range but. And she. She doesn't really feel like she duels. Well, I'll go into more like how I feel about her abilities next week. We do a full coverage on her. But I don't. I don't feel that she has a lot in her kit to do this. But that does mean she's a great trainer. Ad carry. You are learning auto attacks with this champion. And if nothing else, she is one of the cheapest release champions I've seen ever.
She's 3150 for a brand new champion.
[00:57:15] Speaker B: That's.
[00:57:16] Speaker A: I don't think I've seen that ever.
[00:57:18] Speaker C: Yep. They changed it recently. The pricing scheme which is really good because I. You should be able to just enjoy especially if you're a newer player.
Like. No, this is super.
[00:57:29] Speaker A: Now that might change as weeks are coming up. She may have had a discount for the initial release and she might get a little bit more later as the early adoption thing usually gives you a little discount if you want. I mean like I think she's a great training wheel Ad carry because you're going to learn auto attacks.
But I. I think otherwise she's pretty underpowered.
[00:57:59] Speaker B: All right.
So yeah, there's our initial impressions of Yunara. We will talk more about her in the coming weeks. Thanks.
Let's get at least a couple of the shorter listener questions in on this fairly long episode.
We're gonna jump down to some of Rain's shorter questions. Rains, you sent a long big email. We do appreciate it. We will get to those. We just don't have time this episode.
So one of reigns shorter questions.
Why do pro teams have an easier time dealing with tanks than Solo Queue? And is it just because of teamfight coordination with voice comms?
That's it.
A lot of it is just that they're more coordinated and it's harder for tanks to stay alive under focused fire.
[00:58:50] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:58:53] Speaker B: If. If five people all hit the same person, that person will die regardless of what role they are. In most cases.
[00:59:00] Speaker A: And you. And even. Even in pros, sometimes tanks just become almost impossible to kill. You've. You've seen it occasionally where Scion is unkillable for 25 seconds or Mundo just walks past four people and beats up an AD carry. Tanks are hard to kill.
[00:59:21] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:59:24] Speaker A: And they. They should be. They're a tank.
[00:59:26] Speaker B: Yeah.
The problem is when they're a Mundo and can also just murder the out of your ad carry.
So Reigns does continue with how good tanks can be in solo queue. Why don't bruisers like Yorick Mortar Nasus always build full tank slash Dr. Mundo style builds?
So I want to clarify on Reign's question for those who don't know what those builds look like. Full tank is what it sounds like. You're building tank items, Sunfire, Cape, that type of stuff Dr. Mundo builds are different. However, Dr. Mundo builds are specifically health stackers with a late game Overlord's blood.
And the reason that you're not seeing other bruisers do that is they don't have health scaling in their kit and they'll go splat.
[01:00:18] Speaker A: There's like two champions that do that.
Mundo's one of them. Set is the other one.
[01:00:26] Speaker B: Yep.
[01:00:28] Speaker A: And even still set. Almost like he doesn't get a ton of damage out of it outside of his W.
Yep.
[01:00:37] Speaker B: But that's enough that he's still incentivized to do it.
And then you'll see scions do it sometimes.
[01:00:45] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:00:47] Speaker B: But for the rest of them, like Nasus doesn't need a Dr. Mundo style build for damage. He wants a Trinity Force so it's easy for him to stack forever and he just builds full tank after that.
Yorick is kind of in a similar boat. He builds a 80 bruiser with some tankiness built in because he just doesn't need more damage. He's going to kill you off of the healing from his Q Spam.
So again, he wants Trinity Force so that spam hits you like a truck.
And he wants Ability Haste tanky items so he can do it more often and spam at you.
Mordekaiser is weird because he already kind of does build the AP version of a Dr. Mundo build.
Mordekaiser is building a lot of items that are health, AP and some effect he cares about Liandry's, Rylai's, whatever the healing one is that escapes me at the moment. Riftmaker, that kind of stuff are already core for Mord, so he's kind of already doing that. He is building the ap version of Dr. Mundo builds. The reason he doesn't literally build Warmog's Heartsteel, Titanic and Overlord's Bloodmail is he doesn't scale with ap.
[01:02:04] Speaker A: Yeah, but the basic thing is getting health doesn't mean you are a tank.
Yes, and Mundo gets away with it because Mundo has obscene healing regeneration built into his kit. His raw base healing from his passive is massive and his ultimate is stupid.
[01:02:27] Speaker B: And not just that. Like, Mundo literally heals however much health he has on his ultimate. So if he's missing, like, if he's in a fight consistently and never hits full health, his ult will literally heal for his entire health bar over the duration with Spirit Visage. Admittedly, it's only like 60% of his health bar without, but still.
Which means that scaling health literally scales his defense exponentially because of that.
And on top of that, Dr. Mundo gets an ad ratio for health, in case you didn't know that, at max rank on his e, he gets 2.8% of his max health as bonus AD.
[01:03:12] Speaker A: And a lot of the other bruisers that, like, they have health scaling within them also, like, really need physical damage because health scaling doesn't help you for the first 90% of the game until you get that bloodmail. So champions like Olaf, who also do have some, like, health scaling within them, you need. You need damage. You need physical damage. Otherwise you are a worthless champion for 90% of a game.
[01:03:40] Speaker B: Yep.
And then there's champions like Volibear that could be doing the whole health thing, but other builds are just better because Flicker Blades with an AP item on Volibear is just better.
[01:03:51] Speaker A: Or like, realistically, you build 60% this way and then the other 40% into full tank, which actually makes you tankier.
[01:04:01] Speaker B: Yep, it's. It's a whole thing.
Okay, anyone got a Lucian top? I got nothing.
[01:04:14] Speaker A: I mean, if you're struggling with mundo top, maybe you should play Lucian into the top lane. He's one of the people who actually, like, you can get a bork and just shred Mundo's health.
[01:04:25] Speaker B: Please don't actually play Lucian in the Mundo. You will get fucking destroyed. You will get destroyed.
[01:04:29] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:04:31] Speaker B: In general, ranged tops do not actually do well in de Mundo.
[01:04:36] Speaker A: There's one exception. It's Vayne.
[01:04:39] Speaker B: Even then, she can't punt him away because of his passive and he runs her down before she's able to get enough autos to kill him. Him.
And that's the reason you shouldn't play Range Tops in Namundo, because he just runs you down. Once he lands a cleaver, you're done.
[01:04:53] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that. That. That matchup is based on if you can play Vayne really well.
[01:04:58] Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. Anyway, this has been episode 490 of the Four Wards podcast.
I've been Jack Zoman for Mike of Many Names, Codex Ninja.
Have a great night.
[01:05:10] Speaker A: Goodbye. Good night, everybody.
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